[Music]
[Applause]
in most codes of journalism ethics you
would find that the first obligation of
journalists is to tell the truth but
what happens if telling the truth is
harmful to people who help you report it
last summer I went to Chechnya
it’s a southern Republic of Russia
located in the Northern Caucasus for
years it has been torn by a separatist
war and now it is ruled by Ramzan
Kadyrov an authoritarian leader who
inherited his power from his father
Ahmed Chechnya is a kind of place where
one needs to hide his or her memory cars
with recorded material because
journalists are very likely to be
detained and all the material is very
likely to be deleted in my case I chose
to hide it in my bra because since I’m a
woman it is unlikely that it would be
searched very thoroughly kitchen is a
kind of place where there is a code for
everything because you always have to
assume that someone is watching you or
listening in on your conversation you
arrange an interview with a woman a
librarian who has literally build up
libraries from rubble after the work and
when the day of the interview comes she
tells you that she doesn’t feel
beautiful enough to go in front of the
camera at first I laughed at this excuse
but then I realized that that was a code
for her trying to tell me that she
doesn’t feel safe talking to journalists
from abroad and that she thinks that
someone might be listening in on our
conversation Chechnya is a kind of place
which taught me more about journalism
ethics than 10 years in this profession
because my loyalty is a journalist is to
the truth
and today I want to tell you a story of
what happens when telling the truth
makes you doubt whether you are a good
person
so Grozny capital of Chechnya of course
I knew what kind of place it is a place
where dissent can not only land you in
jail but kill you a place had it reached
miserable human rights standards of
Russia that was count as progress but
nothing really prepares you for this
hybrid feudal state it is on one hand
everyone there uses social messengers
the leader of the Republic Ramzan
Kadyrov uses Instagram to communicate
with his people but at the same time the
first thing you see when you exit grows
an airport into the arrivals area is a
huge three meter portrait of Vladimir
Putin President of Russia and next to
him equally huge 3 meter portrait of
akhmad Kadyrov previous leader of the
Republicans father of Ramzan in Grozny
there are literally no ads just this
images of the some sort of unholy
trinity father of mad son
Ramzan and ever-present ghost Vladimir
on tops of houses you find their quotes
in gilded letters but I came to Chechnya
to tell truth so I wanted to tell
stories that lie beyond those facades
and city center of Grozny is a really
surreal place it is like one man’s
postcard for himself it is full of
shining new houses that in fact are just
replicas of famous houses from around
the world
it has cafes and restaurants and and
clean new streets and everything is so
peaceful but you know and you know that
everyone around you knows that you know
that this piece can crack at any moment
at any moment you could be detained by
these men
black uniforms that are everywhere there
they were no science of identification
and they’re also called kabilov men and
once you are in their power there is
very little that can help you because in
Chechnya there is no functional law
instead of the law there is will and
word of Ramzan Kadyrov everything and
everyone bow only to him it is also
dangerous for journalists several months
before my trip to Chechnya bus with
international journalists was detained
on border between Chechnya Ingushetia
neighbouring region the bus all the
belongings of the journalists were
burned down and the journalists
themselves were severely beaten local
journalists often have to flee the
country or their public or face years
and fabricated charges but I went to
Chechnya to tell truth to my audience so
I wanted to know how anyone survives
this regime and anyone who has ever
reported from Chechnya knows that the
air there is thick with fear and this is
not an exaggeration there were so many
times when people saw in Grozny our
camera pointed at them in the street and
they just started praising Khedira
senior or junior out of the blue for no
reason without asking them a second is a
single question probably they thought it
was a safe choice to do so but I went to
Chechnya to tell the truth so we spoke
to as many people as we could we
interviewed members of officially state
organized youth movement literally
called Putin’s youth we interviewed an
official of Asian Republic responsible
for human rights there and she told us
that journalists arranged their own
beatings we reported from a kickboxing
event where Ramzan Kadyrov was was one
of the spectators and he had this reach
table of snacks laid in front of him
fruit and lemonade’s Jew
says pastry of course no alcohol because
the factor in Chechnya there is Sharia
law and before Ramzan Kadyrov arrived at
this event a man in a uniform would hold
this sort of plastic device and scan
this table and then he would listen to
this device and then she would scan the
table again so we concluded this device
must have been a Geiger meter a device
used to measure the activity so the
question is why does it mean that Ramzan
Kadyrov is scared of being poisoned it
is possible because he he does indeed
have many enemies there was also a
microphone strategically placed at this
table so that the whole of this audience
could hear specifically Ramzan Kadyrov’s
comment on this kickboxing match and all
of this was really exciting and exotic
it is this kind of adrenaline filled
guilty thrill that I think many
journalists who reported from this day
dangerous conditions would recognize but
you think is that you are telling this
unique knowledge through your audience
and you know that you’re reporting from
a dangerous environment you will get
recognition and respect for this as a
journalist but I went to Chechnya to
tell the truth so I wanted to tell the
story of stories of people who are
outside of this propaganda driven Ramzan
centered part of Chechnya because I know
that there is one and this was the hard
part
because in this situation you need to
balance needs of your audience and your
own ambitions with interests of people
that would appear in your story and for
Chechens appearing in any story that
criticizes Ramzan Kadyrov in any way is
extremely dangerous there is a famous
case of Ramzan Jalal Dean of a man who
last year appeared on the
question-and-answer session with
Vladimir Putin on state TV the result of
this he complained about not receiving
housing benefits and corruption and
Chechnya there is
out of this was that his house was
burned down he himself was forced
outside of Chechnya together with his
family the whole of his village everyone
there had to sign a letter renouncing
him and he himself also recorded the
video with apologies to Ramzan Kadyrov
so in our work in Chechnya
we had to warn everyone that our story
was quote-unquote political it’s a
euphemism used in Chechnya
it has also code for any story that
criticizes the ruling elite Orca Dieruff
in any way and we had to drop dozens of
interviews just because it would be
unsafe for people when those story is
aired even in Latvia we didn’t know what
would happen to those people maybe
Special Forces would show up at their
door maybe drugs would be planted in
their bags
maybe maybe they’d give trouble at work
there maybe nothing at all would happen
we we just didn’t know so I went to
Chechnya to tell the truth and in a way
I failed or rather I chose to fail
because telling all of it is dangerous
and not for me being facing danger is
part of my job as a journalist but to
people who would appear in my stories
there are so many things I did not tell
from Chechnya a lot of deep and
insightful interviews and amazing
beautiful footage was deleted or never
even made because as reporters we have
to show people how it feels and to see
them to show them things not using
animal sources for instance I dreamt of
going outside of Grozny to film the
stories of rural Chechens and and show
this beautiful amazing mountainous
nature but I knew that the moment we
left a certain village special forces
would show up there and demand to know
what we spoke about I did not tell story
of a youth center maybe the only place
in Grozny
where you feel a bit of freedom where
young people come to share travel
stories and drink tea because we were
warned if their place their center
appeared in a quote unquote
political story even though them
themselves wouldn’t criticize Ramzan
Kadyrov it is likely that their center
would be shut down of course we didn’t
include the interview with this woman
who didn’t feel beautiful enough to talk
in front of the camera we deleted an
interview with beautiful couple of
musicians who sang us their amazing
songs until told us how it is to be
young in Grozny and what does it mean
but there is one story that was
specifically hard for me to delete we
interviewed a woman who had a whose son
had a falling-out with local police the
result was that he was imprisoned
tortured and to save his life he had to
flee the country she was Frank and
explicit and honest and after the after
the interview I asked her if she
understands if she realizes what kind of
consequences she might face for talking
to us and she told me well whatever
happens is in the hands of Allah but for
me this was not good enough I am an
atheist and I know that whatever happens
to this woman is not responsability of
Allah it is my responsibility this was
not an easy choice because she was in
the spotlight before and it was likely
that nothing would happen and what she
told me really would make my report much
stronger much more emotional but in the
end I chose to leave it out because I
realized that in the end of the day
after this my trip I would go home to
safety and she would spend the rest of
her life
in Grozny
so you can see here it is this conflict
between two loyalties and I have not
experienced it to the same extent before
in my work conflict between my loyalty
is a journalist to tell my audience the
truth and my also and my loyalty to my
heroes not to harm them of course as an
investigative journalist I’m used to
protecting sources but those are people
who come forward willingly themselves to
expose something they calculate the
risks but here I had to protect ordinary
Grozny inhabitants who just happened to
be in my way when I came to Chechnya and
this is an equation that I cannot solve
when does being overprotective prevent
me from being a good journalist how can
I expose injustice at all if I censor
anything of the reality if I leave
anything out
how can I tell you to the full extent
what happens in Chechnya if I play by
the rules of Ramzan Kadyrov don’t I just
reinforce his regime but at the same
time Who am I to storm into people’s
lives and make them even more miserable
in the name of some distant ideas Who am
I to use their daily tragedy for my
agenda that might have nothing to do
with their lives and this is everything
that in the end everyone who reports
from oppressive regimes faces this and I
think that we are walking on very thin
ice two years ago there was a Swiss
documentary Grozny blues presented in
one of the movie festivals abroad
outside of Russia and that followed
female human rights activists after the
movie was presented one of these women
had to flee Chechnya one was abducted
and beaten another one was abducted that
then she recorded a video denying the
fact of her abduction the director of
that movie festival where Grozny booze
was presented he was quoted in the media
saying that one of these
women she allowed herself to criticize
Ramzan Kadyrov and this is why she found
herself in the situation but my question
is shouldn’t documentary makers bear
some responsibility for what happened to
these women and there is a film called
in the Rays of the Rising Sun by a
brilliant documentary maker Vitaly Mann
scheme he pretended to be cooperating
with the regime of North Korea and in
the end he what he filmed was not a
propaganda film as was expected by North
Korean authorities but the film about
how North Korean regime works exposed
this regime my question is do we know
what happened to these people who had
whom he had semi secretly filmed do we
know if they are fine now in North Korea
do we know if there may be in prison do
we know if they are alive and you see
here again there is this conflict
between loyalties a reporter’s job is to
show you how it feels to live in a
society like this that oppresses its own
people but it often contradicts the
interests of those people who live in
those situations it might even endanger
their lives so is there a solution well
I do not think that there is an easy fix
I just hope that after this this
conversation you become more aware of
ethical dilemmas that lie beyond any
journalistic work that exposes
authoritarian regimes I definitely
became much more aware of this
situations and there is this one man
that I can’t stop thinking about we in
Grozny were interviewing people in the
streets and asking them what they think
of Ramzan Kadyrov’s regime of course the
answers were mostly scripted because it
is danger
to say anything but praise about Khedira
Fantasia but there is this one man and
what he told me would be totally
innocent in a free and democratic state
but could easily land him in jail and
grows named and to this day I often
think about him and I have no way of
knowing if he is safe so we approached
him on the street in Grozny on this main
street called Putin’s Avenue next to
this beautiful mosque and we asked him
if he is happy how Ramzan Kadyrov is
running the country he waited and asked
and and and he asked is is this thing
one like he was pointing at the camera
and when I told him that yes the camera
is running he took this really long
and he said you know I would rather not say anything
[Applause]
in most codes of journalism ethics you
would find that the first obligation of
journalists is to tell the truth but
what happens if telling the truth is
harmful to people who help you report it
last summer I went to Chechnya
it’s a southern Republic of Russia
located in the Northern Caucasus for
years it has been torn by a separatist
war and now it is ruled by Ramzan
Kadyrov an authoritarian leader who
inherited his power from his father
Ahmed Chechnya is a kind of place where
one needs to hide his or her memory cars
with recorded material because
journalists are very likely to be
detained and all the material is very
likely to be deleted in my case I chose
to hide it in my bra because since I’m a
woman it is unlikely that it would be
searched very thoroughly kitchen is a
kind of place where there is a code for
everything because you always have to
assume that someone is watching you or
listening in on your conversation you
arrange an interview with a woman a
librarian who has literally build up
libraries from rubble after the work and
when the day of the interview comes she
tells you that she doesn’t feel
beautiful enough to go in front of the
camera at first I laughed at this excuse
but then I realized that that was a code
for her trying to tell me that she
doesn’t feel safe talking to journalists
from abroad and that she thinks that
someone might be listening in on our
conversation Chechnya is a kind of place
which taught me more about journalism
ethics than 10 years in this profession
because my loyalty is a journalist is to
the truth
and today I want to tell you a story of
what happens when telling the truth
makes you doubt whether you are a good
person
so Grozny capital of Chechnya of course
I knew what kind of place it is a place
where dissent can not only land you in
jail but kill you a place had it reached
miserable human rights standards of
Russia that was count as progress but
nothing really prepares you for this
hybrid feudal state it is on one hand
everyone there uses social messengers
the leader of the Republic Ramzan
Kadyrov uses Instagram to communicate
with his people but at the same time the
first thing you see when you exit grows
an airport into the arrivals area is a
huge three meter portrait of Vladimir
Putin President of Russia and next to
him equally huge 3 meter portrait of
akhmad Kadyrov previous leader of the
Republicans father of Ramzan in Grozny
there are literally no ads just this
images of the some sort of unholy
trinity father of mad son
Ramzan and ever-present ghost Vladimir
on tops of houses you find their quotes
in gilded letters but I came to Chechnya
to tell truth so I wanted to tell
stories that lie beyond those facades
and city center of Grozny is a really
surreal place it is like one man’s
postcard for himself it is full of
shining new houses that in fact are just
replicas of famous houses from around
the world
it has cafes and restaurants and and
clean new streets and everything is so
peaceful but you know and you know that
everyone around you knows that you know
that this piece can crack at any moment
at any moment you could be detained by
these men
black uniforms that are everywhere there
they were no science of identification
and they’re also called kabilov men and
once you are in their power there is
very little that can help you because in
Chechnya there is no functional law
instead of the law there is will and
word of Ramzan Kadyrov everything and
everyone bow only to him it is also
dangerous for journalists several months
before my trip to Chechnya bus with
international journalists was detained
on border between Chechnya Ingushetia
neighbouring region the bus all the
belongings of the journalists were
burned down and the journalists
themselves were severely beaten local
journalists often have to flee the
country or their public or face years
and fabricated charges but I went to
Chechnya to tell truth to my audience so
I wanted to know how anyone survives
this regime and anyone who has ever
reported from Chechnya knows that the
air there is thick with fear and this is
not an exaggeration there were so many
times when people saw in Grozny our
camera pointed at them in the street and
they just started praising Khedira
senior or junior out of the blue for no
reason without asking them a second is a
single question probably they thought it
was a safe choice to do so but I went to
Chechnya to tell the truth so we spoke
to as many people as we could we
interviewed members of officially state
organized youth movement literally
called Putin’s youth we interviewed an
official of Asian Republic responsible
for human rights there and she told us
that journalists arranged their own
beatings we reported from a kickboxing
event where Ramzan Kadyrov was was one
of the spectators and he had this reach
table of snacks laid in front of him
fruit and lemonade’s Jew
says pastry of course no alcohol because
the factor in Chechnya there is Sharia
law and before Ramzan Kadyrov arrived at
this event a man in a uniform would hold
this sort of plastic device and scan
this table and then he would listen to
this device and then she would scan the
table again so we concluded this device
must have been a Geiger meter a device
used to measure the activity so the
question is why does it mean that Ramzan
Kadyrov is scared of being poisoned it
is possible because he he does indeed
have many enemies there was also a
microphone strategically placed at this
table so that the whole of this audience
could hear specifically Ramzan Kadyrov’s
comment on this kickboxing match and all
of this was really exciting and exotic
it is this kind of adrenaline filled
guilty thrill that I think many
journalists who reported from this day
dangerous conditions would recognize but
you think is that you are telling this
unique knowledge through your audience
and you know that you’re reporting from
a dangerous environment you will get
recognition and respect for this as a
journalist but I went to Chechnya to
tell the truth so I wanted to tell the
story of stories of people who are
outside of this propaganda driven Ramzan
centered part of Chechnya because I know
that there is one and this was the hard
part
because in this situation you need to
balance needs of your audience and your
own ambitions with interests of people
that would appear in your story and for
Chechens appearing in any story that
criticizes Ramzan Kadyrov in any way is
extremely dangerous there is a famous
case of Ramzan Jalal Dean of a man who
last year appeared on the
question-and-answer session with
Vladimir Putin on state TV the result of
this he complained about not receiving
housing benefits and corruption and
Chechnya there is
out of this was that his house was
burned down he himself was forced
outside of Chechnya together with his
family the whole of his village everyone
there had to sign a letter renouncing
him and he himself also recorded the
video with apologies to Ramzan Kadyrov
so in our work in Chechnya
we had to warn everyone that our story
was quote-unquote political it’s a
euphemism used in Chechnya
it has also code for any story that
criticizes the ruling elite Orca Dieruff
in any way and we had to drop dozens of
interviews just because it would be
unsafe for people when those story is
aired even in Latvia we didn’t know what
would happen to those people maybe
Special Forces would show up at their
door maybe drugs would be planted in
their bags
maybe maybe they’d give trouble at work
there maybe nothing at all would happen
we we just didn’t know so I went to
Chechnya to tell the truth and in a way
I failed or rather I chose to fail
because telling all of it is dangerous
and not for me being facing danger is
part of my job as a journalist but to
people who would appear in my stories
there are so many things I did not tell
from Chechnya a lot of deep and
insightful interviews and amazing
beautiful footage was deleted or never
even made because as reporters we have
to show people how it feels and to see
them to show them things not using
animal sources for instance I dreamt of
going outside of Grozny to film the
stories of rural Chechens and and show
this beautiful amazing mountainous
nature but I knew that the moment we
left a certain village special forces
would show up there and demand to know
what we spoke about I did not tell story
of a youth center maybe the only place
in Grozny
where you feel a bit of freedom where
young people come to share travel
stories and drink tea because we were
warned if their place their center
appeared in a quote unquote
political story even though them
themselves wouldn’t criticize Ramzan
Kadyrov it is likely that their center
would be shut down of course we didn’t
include the interview with this woman
who didn’t feel beautiful enough to talk
in front of the camera we deleted an
interview with beautiful couple of
musicians who sang us their amazing
songs until told us how it is to be
young in Grozny and what does it mean
but there is one story that was
specifically hard for me to delete we
interviewed a woman who had a whose son
had a falling-out with local police the
result was that he was imprisoned
tortured and to save his life he had to
flee the country she was Frank and
explicit and honest and after the after
the interview I asked her if she
understands if she realizes what kind of
consequences she might face for talking
to us and she told me well whatever
happens is in the hands of Allah but for
me this was not good enough I am an
atheist and I know that whatever happens
to this woman is not responsability of
Allah it is my responsibility this was
not an easy choice because she was in
the spotlight before and it was likely
that nothing would happen and what she
told me really would make my report much
stronger much more emotional but in the
end I chose to leave it out because I
realized that in the end of the day
after this my trip I would go home to
safety and she would spend the rest of
her life
in Grozny
so you can see here it is this conflict
between two loyalties and I have not
experienced it to the same extent before
in my work conflict between my loyalty
is a journalist to tell my audience the
truth and my also and my loyalty to my
heroes not to harm them of course as an
investigative journalist I’m used to
protecting sources but those are people
who come forward willingly themselves to
expose something they calculate the
risks but here I had to protect ordinary
Grozny inhabitants who just happened to
be in my way when I came to Chechnya and
this is an equation that I cannot solve
when does being overprotective prevent
me from being a good journalist how can
I expose injustice at all if I censor
anything of the reality if I leave
anything out
how can I tell you to the full extent
what happens in Chechnya if I play by
the rules of Ramzan Kadyrov don’t I just
reinforce his regime but at the same
time Who am I to storm into people’s
lives and make them even more miserable
in the name of some distant ideas Who am
I to use their daily tragedy for my
agenda that might have nothing to do
with their lives and this is everything
that in the end everyone who reports
from oppressive regimes faces this and I
think that we are walking on very thin
ice two years ago there was a Swiss
documentary Grozny blues presented in
one of the movie festivals abroad
outside of Russia and that followed
female human rights activists after the
movie was presented one of these women
had to flee Chechnya one was abducted
and beaten another one was abducted that
then she recorded a video denying the
fact of her abduction the director of
that movie festival where Grozny booze
was presented he was quoted in the media
saying that one of these
women she allowed herself to criticize
Ramzan Kadyrov and this is why she found
herself in the situation but my question
is shouldn’t documentary makers bear
some responsibility for what happened to
these women and there is a film called
in the Rays of the Rising Sun by a
brilliant documentary maker Vitaly Mann
scheme he pretended to be cooperating
with the regime of North Korea and in
the end he what he filmed was not a
propaganda film as was expected by North
Korean authorities but the film about
how North Korean regime works exposed
this regime my question is do we know
what happened to these people who had
whom he had semi secretly filmed do we
know if they are fine now in North Korea
do we know if there may be in prison do
we know if they are alive and you see
here again there is this conflict
between loyalties a reporter’s job is to
show you how it feels to live in a
society like this that oppresses its own
people but it often contradicts the
interests of those people who live in
those situations it might even endanger
their lives so is there a solution well
I do not think that there is an easy fix
I just hope that after this this
conversation you become more aware of
ethical dilemmas that lie beyond any
journalistic work that exposes
authoritarian regimes I definitely
became much more aware of this
situations and there is this one man
that I can’t stop thinking about we in
Grozny were interviewing people in the
streets and asking them what they think
of Ramzan Kadyrov’s regime of course the
answers were mostly scripted because it
is danger
to say anything but praise about Khedira
Fantasia but there is this one man and
what he told me would be totally
innocent in a free and democratic state
but could easily land him in jail and
grows named and to this day I often
think about him and I have no way of
knowing if he is safe so we approached
him on the street in Grozny on this main
street called Putin’s Avenue next to
this beautiful mosque and we asked him
if he is happy how Ramzan Kadyrov is
running the country he waited and asked
and and and he asked is is this thing
one like he was pointing at the camera
and when I told him that yes the camera
is running he took this really long
and he said you know I would rather not say anything
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