hello everyone marco montemagno here the
tech alchemist and today with me we r 3
is the first time we are free and I’m
here with Chris Johnson and jazz amor
from simply feem hi guys how are you
okay good to be with you so I normally
the tech alchemist interviews are a
split screen interview so it’s very easy
I talk or the gas stoke but in 3 i’m
sure we’ll we’ll create a big Kells but
we’ll try our best because the topic was
so so interesting and so many people are
asking about help tips and advices to
create better demo videos demo videos so
I as tech alchemist community knows I
love to talk about product or services
or company that I’m testing or that i’ve
been using or that i used in the past
and simplify i’m i’m working with you
guys and I’m very happy about it until
this moment and we try to create a demo
video for the tech alchemist so it’s
very interesting for me to see also
behind the scenes how it works what what
what is required to create a created my
video and I thought was a very good to
share this kind of knowledge with the
tech alchemist community because a lot
of good stuff here so first of all that
the main question is demo videos are
everywhere can we explain in 30 seconds
what is a demo video and why are we
start to see demo videos everywhere in
the web who get the question I’ll go for
it here a demo videos a way to get a
user to understand what your product
does really really fast and it makes
them hopefully it makes them feel like
they’re actually using the product and
the goal of a demo video is to convey
the specifics the honest truth of what
your product does in a light that makes
it easy to understand and why we’re
seeing on the web is too it’s a very
succinct effective way to get a message
across you don’t have to read a whole
ton of copy you can figure out what a
website or an app or a service or
whatever it is does fast
right I just go straight to the point
and I tell you why I decided to to go
with simply film so you have a real
customer feedback with the real reason
why a person or company decided to go
with a company like you I was going
around and I mean for the last 15 years
have been watching tones of demo videos
of all kind of companies and when I
decided to create tech alchemist video I
was sick and tired about this cartoonish
demo videos with with the animation of a
kind of Simpson style cartoon I thought
gosh I don’t know if it works I have no
idea but I’m tired and I think it’s
boring III don’t know what’s really not
coming when I arrived no simple film I
read some paper some reasons behind the
fact that this is not the way to go and
I would like to to literally talk about
it because I think it’s very interesting
well alleged agent talk about metaphors
in just a second but we call them that
this is dumb videos you know this is dog
dog has a problem now there’s an app it
solves the problem and they don’t work
there kind of sending I mean we want to
make sure that we indicate that the
company that we’re working with his high
quality and that’s why Jason builds a
metaphor as opposed to just those blobby
stupid cartoon characters that don’t
work on what he does so we we would
never make the same video well did Jason
can talk about that who never make the
same video over and over again well I
think I’ll first just start by saying
that while cartoon characters have sort
of at a history as being spokespeople
for products or whatever in the
advertising industry we’ve largely moved
away from you know things like the Jolly
Green Giant and in those sorts of you
know the Pillsbury Doughboy although I
guess he’s still around but i think that
people may not take your product
seriously if there’s a cartoon pitching
it and it just in the kind of the
creative economy that we’re in now and
so we’re really big fans of using
metaphor which is sort of a tangible way
of expressing abstract
ideas or thoughts or to take something
that’s a little bit hard you know taking
your software that you know very well
and you spend a lot of time in that’s
that’s a lot to buy it off and so
through you know some sort of a visual
image or metaphor we’re able to convey a
whole lot of information and not very
much time in a way that sticks the thing
I love about metaphor is that when you
use a metaphor and you encounter that
metaphor again later on away from the
website it it creates recall so you
think about the video that you saw when
you re encounter that metaphor for a
second time right also because my
feeling about cartoons is that or I mean
your brand I’m thinking about MailChimp
for instance or brand that have had a
cartoon inside their logo is part of
their their image their brand then maybe
it makes sense otherwise you see a brand
and then you see a cartoon that has
nothing to do with with the brand the
dog that the crib all was talking about
and then you think well what the hell is
DS I mean I’m not a 3 years old kid I
don’t guys what do you think about it
well it works for mailchimp but we have
they have a character this is an asset
that they were using again what we think
you know these one-off generic cartoon
characters that are just totally
interchangeable don’t work because it’s
it’s just saying hey we’re a tech
company too and there’s absolutely no
creativity behind out those creations
right and it’s I think the difference
with like a company like male chip is
that the chimp is built into the name of
their company I mean in a sense they’re
using that as almost a visual metaphor
where a lot of companies use cartoon
characters and videos it’s sort of just
tacked on at the end it really has
nothing to do with their product and as
Chris said it chris said earlier we
don’t like to make the same video over
and over and a lot of those cartoon
style videos it’s the same characters
over and over you slap a different logo
on the end of it but it’s really not
about the company it’s about the video
you’re buying it so if we do our job
right at simple phone we want to be
invisible we want to inherit the
properties of your company take on your
look we want to be kind of invisible at
it and you know a lot of the companies
out there that are using kind of the
cartoon approach really are the style
that they created is more about them
than their customers at least that’s
sort of our feeling yeah we want to
inherit and enhance the properties in
the design assets that are already built
so if you’ve got a book you know
best-selling book or a you know instead
of creative work we want to take what
you’ve already built and then and then
take that further into motion graphics
net the difference between us and some
of our competitors we don’t you know
we’re not the same companies as they are
they have different philosophies when
our philosophy it’s just to take what
you’ve done and translate and enhance it
okay no III standard general vision
about videos and do you think a demo
video so videos that explain product
service or a book or something are good
for any kind of industry or there are
industry where you say no guys you
better stop popping videos probably are
not the right way to to explain what’s
your feedback about well I would say
when Chris and I first started working
together I would regularly say to him I
don’t care what story it is I’ll tell
any story I think I think that if you it
matters how you approach a video i think
if you tell you have to create stories i
think that’s what draws people in and i
think that well i’ll just say I’ve not
encountered an industry at that you
can’t tell you can’t find a way to tell
a story if you’re only trying to present
the product and the facts of the product
and the features and there’s no that’s
why we love metaphors of metaphor sort
of incorporate story into the overall
video the idea is that there’s a
beginning middle and end and that over
the course of that there’s sort of a
narrative and it’s not like creating a
you know like a little mini movie or a
mini with the cartoon characters but it
is there sort of a visual narrative
that happens and I feel like that can
apply to really any industry out there
now Chris may have a different different
take on that but that’s I think where I
would land on that yeah I’ll say that
there’s there’s certainly industries and
businesses that it’s not cost-effective
to get you know a simple film where I
you know that a premium explainer video
type of treatment you know there’s some
things that you should just do slides
there should there are some times where
you should just do a screencast so I’m
not going to tell you that that
everybody who gets a video is going to
make money it’s a case by case basis if
you have a product that has a scale
people following you’re trying to either
activate your followers or build
awareness then it makes sense but if
you’re if you’re if you’re not at the
right size and then you know it’s a
force fit it doesn’t make sense well
another thing one other thing I would
just add to that is that we have on
occasion begun to work with a client and
realize that that we can’t tell the
story they want to tell or they want to
tell a story that’s sort of outside of
our wheelhouse or they want sort of a
glorified PowerPoint you know glorified
PowerPoint file and really we want to
work with clients that want to tell
stories and tell stories well and so I
wouldn’t say that I’m encountering an
industry that it doesn’t work for but we
have encountered clients on a few
occasions that that don’t see the vision
for where we want to help take them and
that’s okay there’s no you know there’s
room for many companies out there so
that you know there’s lots of stuff we
consider ourselves to be more artists
rather than technicians and a lot of
people want us to just do their
paint-by-numbers animation and that’s
just not something that we’re into yeah
also after you’ve been working on the
tech alchemist the benchmark is so high
and it’s so beautiful to work with me
that is difficult to work with any other
company I understand this but ok I hope
you’ll try to find hey we’re gonna we’re
gonna put you in our mission statement
from here on out so we’re done I mean
we’ve we’re not even gonna bother going
after Apple we’ve got you you know what
do we need um let’s stay on them
on this side I I was um curious too I
was always thinking that a great video
is and this is my by the ways my I’m
fully convinced about it that a great
video is in 2012 and in the next year’s
will be unbelievable powerful online so
if i see i don’t know someone writing a
post and i create a video i have a
totally different impact on the audience
so it’s so important but on the other
side are just a few days ago I saw these
stats about Facebook sharing and a
simple static image looks like is being
shared a much more than a video so I was
I don’t know I was not really convinced
about it also you know you have tone
source or stats in about this but in
your opinion I mean it the video you
know viral video is what people is
talking about but on social media do you
see that video are the most effective
form or you have evidence that maybe I
don’t know images or a different form ax
can work better well Wow one thing I
would say is I i think that people tend
to want to say way too much so the thing
about sharing images that’s very easy as
it doesn’t take very it’s not much of a
time investment so you look at an image
and you you know get your laugh out of
it you and you share that or whatever
we’re pretty we wrestle a little bit
sometimes with our clients because they
want to make a you know five minute
video or something like that people just
want invest the time in it so I again I
think story is important if you have a
great story to tell if it’s visually
interesting there’s a sense of mystery
or intrigue like where is this going to
go and you keep it short I feel like
those are the kind of videos that get
passed a lot around a whole lot more
than then watching some sort of a you
know a long diatribe kind of trailer you
know you want to make sure that you when
you make a video you want to make sure
that you don’t give people enough
information to say no I don’t want it
you want
try to get under their skin so you know
our image is going to share fat spread
faster than videos yeah probably but a
video can get under your skin you know
you you have to see this movie you have
to buy this app is this that you have a
hole in your soul that you have to fill
and you know if we do the video right it
creates a need and it creates an ache
for you know they miss this product I
wish they had a product like every other
like you know like what I no headway
themes or whatever we’ve you know reps
before that that’s that’s the desire
that a video is hoping you know we hope
to create create another thing that was
really intriguing me about simplifying
the first time that I came on the
website probably I i arrived at to you
guys because I I sudas this trailer from
Ryan Holliday the confessions of a media
manipulator and I I thought gosh this is
an amazing video you know and kind of
Hollywood since ET style and I thought
amazing it will cost I don’t know
$50,000 I don’t know it looks like
really you know Hollywood production and
I think this is also another point you
know probably if you can keep the course
that is not a Hollywood production and
you can bring quality videos to two
companies for demo videos then probably
company will start to embrace and I
think you started this trend and I think
it’s very interesting what do you think
I think I wish you would have been in
one sign of the check if you thought it
was worth 50,000 yeah so it’s kind of
price ceilings for stuff even a
best-selling book I don’t think it makes
much sense to spend more than ten or
fifteen thousand dollars on a video i
don’t think the ROI you know works above
that too well i think that it’s you know
you want to send a strong signal that
your quality but if you’re spending 25
30 thousand powers it doesn’t it’s not
going to pay back even if the video it’s
a million views and it does you know
those as well as like throw in holiday
with us if you know so you got to just
realize that and be respectful to the
industries and the people that you’re
working with we want to make the nexus
video we can so that for the lowest
price possible
and that’s always a constant battle
because crying you know costs money and
if we had more time we’d always be able
to do more stuff but we have to get
stuff done and keep it moving uh on a
regular basis right to the you
anticipated a question that I always
have in my mind the right cost today
2012 for a good quality demo video so is
if you have to give a range of price for
business will want to have a demo video
the industry i say i’m not telling
specifically about sympathy well there’s
there’s kind of two ways to go about it
between 0 and a thousand dollars that’s
a pretty safe and low-risk way to get a
video done and if that’s a that’s a good
decision for a lot of people you know
get a five-hundred-dollar video or a you
know get somebody to help you with some
styles for a low-end they’re just kind
of a real big no-man’s land between like
110 thousand dollars where you’re going
to get a lot of different kinds of
quality and a lot of the same video is
going to get made you’re not gonna be
original you’re not going to stand out
and then you know if you spend too much
doesn’t make sense so i would say that a
good quality demo video would be between
10 and say twenty five thousand dollars
for a 90-second ish piece can give or
take a few seconds and if you’ve got
some assets already built for design
work already done that may change the
fraser influence it that way right
although on the creative side of
creating a video producing a video i was
curious to understand in your experience
I mean you’re doing only animation so
spare
graphic effects and so on or do you
think also it makes sense when you
storytelling a video to introduce also I
know real people interviews Faye real
faces or you just choose animation
because you think is the most effective
way to go what was the reason behind it
that’s a great question i think we at
simplify them haven’t done anything with
life on-camera talent i think that that
can work part of it for us is that I
think that we know it’s our niche you
know we know that we can do that very
well it’s also pretty exciting you know
it’s it’s something that not everyone
can do it just has that additional edge
I think animation does that that sets
you apart a little bit from from video
because even a novice can pick up the
camera and you know I mean there are
certainly an art to cinematography and
lighting and that sort of thing but not
everyone can can animate you know that
sort of thing so I feel like animation
creates that kind of sticking power that
people want I mean that the Ryan holiday
trailer you talked about I saw a lot of
reactions to that like wow I didn’t see
that coming or you know doing a giant
media octopus or whatever is there’s
something more visually intriguing about
that than simply hearing the author
safety words about his book or her book
you know so I don’t know it just gives
that sort of extra something I think
that keeps people plugged in the other
thing about animation from a business
perspective which is um if you change
your product if you change something you
don’t have to recreate the whole set
reach we create everything if you learn
get some insight that says customers
want this instead of that it’s possible
to do a drop in and to recreate a scene
you don’t have to throw away your whole
animation so if you get rid of a feature
or add a feature or you know add an
integration you can just add it to the
animation later so it’s a lot more
flexible than a live-action dollar for
dollar now I’m going to be when I say
that simple phone probably will
eventually get into some live action so
that will probably do that when we can
be
good as we are at it at you know as we
are an animation we want to be the best
in the world no exceptions and we’re
getting there in animation want to get
there you know in the live-action side
when we can really compete and remember
when we have something to say when it’s
time for us to do that we’ll go and tell
stories in whatever medium we need to
tell stories in if I could just add what
if I could just have one other thought
especially with our book trailers the
idea is that we want to make that cover
of that book or that world sort of come
to life and that’s hard to do with just
someone sitting in front of a camera so
we again trying to inherit the
properties of whatever software we’re
doing or whatever company story we’re
dealing or whatever author whatever book
we’re telling the story for it so we
want everything in that trailer from the
time you it begins so the time it ends
to sort of feel like you’ve lived in
that world for a minute and a half let’s
talk now about the process um I’m
leaving I’m uh I’m a process you know
I’m living on my own my skin I have your
your stuff on my my head every day you
know about all the steps to follow mark
oh you already did this but you have to
give feedback on the script and the
voice and everything so is when I
started I I didn’t think it was so well
structured so that the process to arrive
to create a video because I was used you
know to get someone who just give me an
O prototype and say yeah you like this
no let’s change maybe the call or you
know but you follow a much more
structure structure and I think most a
more effective way can you maybe create
or or jasmine can you explain a little
bit better what are the most important
steps in the process of creating a demo
video well setting expectations from my
end is the most important part so you
know you you know what to expect you
know what’s going to happen now you know
it’s going to happen next that’s that’s
gonna my end because that’s how I run
the that part of a friend experience
along with Dennis our Directorate
details
we want to make sure that you understand
exactly what’s happened was about to
happen and what you need to do at
anything from for our respective cases
from my perspective I usually come in
after after the script has been
completed and our scripts normally don’t
have a lot of visual cues it will have
occasionally wats and stuff that will do
uh but my job is to somehow it take that
script and interpret it visually and one
of the things I think is the worst thing
you can do as as a video storyteller is
to start at the computer because I feel
like what you end up with something
that’s really neat my candy but it
doesn’t really tell a story so you’ve
got pretty colors or neat effects or
whatever but you’re not really focused
on the kind of the creative aspects of
storytelling and how you keep the viewer
engaged so I will step away from the
computer sometimes and I’ll spend a day
or maybe I shouldn’t say I step away
from the computer but I step away from
my animation tools and I’ll go out and
look at what inspires me I’ll try and
look for references just what looks hot
what doesn’t and sometimes it’ll be two
days of just trying to get my head
around what this thing is before I ever
begin animating so that approach is very
different than an approach where the
backgrounds always the same aim where
the characters are always the same or
whatever again we at some of them we
really try to make our videos seamless
so from the moment it begins to the
moment it ends the cameras are tracking
along and we’re telling the story
without breaks we want to keep the
viewer engaged all the way and then
again the use of metaphor is pretty
consistent that we’re always trying to
find visual ways like the mountains that
start off in the beginning of your video
that sort of look like a chart but it’s
also a mountain you know it’s just a an
interesting visual that kind of keep
people engaged in story right by the way
my surname is montemagno among the means
mountain so this is an additional tape
that you want to know what I tell you so
it’s very interesting cool no
we did we research that for a long time
we research that but on curbs every
night service simply film spies around
my house yes right right can we sum up
so the most important steps when
creating a good demo video so collecting
all the data about products services if
one step setting the right expectations
writing a script so writing a story that
makes sense and then start to creating
the animation choosing the voice this is
another point I will do a very stupid
question but I was always thinking about
that it does it perform better a Boys
and male voice of female voice it really
depends by the the project do you have
any stats or your experience about that
is it takes you in a direction another
well it depends on the product for sure
you know that’s something that’s fairly
easy and fairly inexpensive and
straightforward to test out sometimes it
doesn’t make any difference at all so
that’s that’s probably in fifty percent
of cases it doesn’t make a lot of
difference whether it’s a male voice or
female voice it’s a matter of taste and
preference and how you want to support
the brand sometimes a male voice will
outperform the female voice even when it
seems to be behind so like if if a video
um I think it was yes where that the
female voice people watched to the video
till the end more than the male but
people bought the product more from the
male even though they only watched half
the video and so that’s a success right
i mean that’s a win if you get people to
convert because of the video that that
you have so um that’s something that
it’s you know Wistia and there’s a
number of other tools that make it
fairly straightforward to test different
video objects and you want to do a fair
amount of that you don’t want to assess
over because um you know want to create
you want to you don’t want to create
another job for yourself but you want to
take a look at it and see and if you
know if you have a strong feeling and
you want to represent your brand a
certain way that’s the way to go right I
mean if you don’t have a preference than
something testing maybe something you
try to do and we’re pretty careful about
the voices we choose to
we try to make sure that if if you got a
more corporate client we get somewhere
that sounds a little more
straightforward corporate we’ve got our
we’ve got a go-to guy for young and hip
you know we’ve got we’ve got our go-to
people for different styles and there
been a time there’s been a time or two I
think that we’ve cast a voice that
wasn’t quite the right fit and have even
gone back to any pre recorded voices
read after realizing that maybe we
didn’t have the right one in there does
voiceover work makes a huge difference
I’ve been given to choose several voices
and one was very sexy like Angelina
Jolie and I immediately say yeah I want
this one and then you’re then it’s a no
way is not good for the tech alchemist
and you gave me guys I don’t know a man
like Sean Connery I did it but okay good
no that’s excellent um about converting
um this is our dough interesting point
so a video that convert this is in the
end the goal I think to have a video
that bring a result not only that people
say oh this is a nice video what are the
metrics that you try to look to
understand if a video convert or not
well I think it’s important to show the
actual product or a sec similarly the
product you know showing people that
they really have something here rather
than than you know showing a phone with
with things bursting out of it showing
the screens of the of the product that
is an engineered and built and an
intentional product it’s going to go a
long way to make people more comfortable
because then they’re going to say oh
this is a real thing this isn’t just
somebody’s fantasy and I can see this
right here and then what I can use that
if you like to detective stuff in these
heels and I get this thing so that’s the
young that that’s my gut feeling and
when we’ve done more and more showing
the product the customer feedback will
be very active for us we also sometimes
hear from our clients that there excuse
me their sales increase one of our
clients said that they their sales trip
day after three put our video out also I
feel like we have a lot of repeat
clients
and right while we don’t hear specific
numbers um we’re pretty certain that
they’re converting their video to
customers or they would be coming back
to us we’re not cheap and they can pay
us a couple of times so you know that
said something to do they say right yeah
right just a must oh ok a couple of
question um how long it takes to create
a good demo video to give a business
listening to us so how long is the right
timing to create a good demo videos and
what’s the best length for a demo video
good question for us it takes about 150
hours of animation 100 250 hours of
animation we’re big fans of the minute
to a minute and a half timeline we think
there are diminishing returns the more
that you go past a minute and a half
viewers just don’t hang that long Chris
can probably talk more about the process
free video but we’ve got about 150 hours
of animation yeah as far as like time
that it takes you know in for the
business person o’carroll hours we spend
but but I’m going to say that generally
from from when you send your contract
and deposit to us to delivery it’s
anywhere between six weeks when we’re
fast and and everything works right in
that there’s not a lot of revisions to
12 to 15 weeks if it takes a while to
get there what what why not happening is
that we don’t get feedback back from
clients and we kind of get stuck so if a
client doesn’t have you know you need
some feedback back you know if you don’t
have an approval on this particular
section and we’re stuck um we’re
stopping we can’t move forward so you
know we don’t want to lose three days we
go we ship to another project whatever
we have to do to to keep the key bars
not moving because our animators you
know Jason and his team are not cheap
either and that we want to make sure
that they’re working so um the client
can really influence it by you know
making it easy getting assets to us
their logos their their animations there
in all other stock from assets and
getting us also the oh the approvals on
a timely fashion on in a timely fashion
that’s why we keep harassing me the best
legs I was like 70 or 75 seconds because
after you know we’ve seen the numbers
and its ear you know we don’t it it’s
seriously erodes fast after you know
after 70 or so seconds people abandon it
even if they’re well-intentioned because
you know the longer you stay doing one
thing the more risk there is of doing
something else right so um that makes
sense you know you’re doing one thing
and your phone could ring your boss can
come in your dog could want to go
outside and you’re watching a video you
can get yep you get pulled away from
this we want to get the message out
there underman and a hat for sure and
the other thing is I feel like the video
is really just meant to be an invitation
into the door so we’re not trying to say
everything there is to say about the
video we there are still things that
would be communicated on the website um
could be things that are communicated in
print you know could be think that a
Salesman might share with you but the
video is really meant to sort of create
a level of comfort you know welcome into
our world come in have a seat you know
we’ll share the rest of it with you in
in a different formula final question
guys and then I to go what’s the best
tip that you can give to a company that
want to have a demo video if you just
want it what would you recommend hire us
for next year alligator my one tip would
be less is more don’t try to say
everything pick one or two or three
things and go with the drunk don’t you
are in love with your software or your
product or your book or whatever but the
people that you’re talking to that
you’re trying to reach are not yet in
love with it and they don’t care about
everything so one or two or three things
are going to do a whole lot more for you
than trying to save more than that no I
would I would say that probably you want
to try to
make a script that gets under their skin
and take some chances don’t try to say
everything don’t play it safe be bold
and and try to be daring with what
you’re doing if you’re in a marketplace
its competitive you want to stand out
and figure competition by being daring
by being specific and not being we’re
just another app like everybody else
this is doug doug has an app for his
iphone that doesn’t work be daring
excellent guys I have to stop here I I
stole so much time of you but the great
tips a lot of interesting stuff thank
you so much as a more Chris Johnson
simply film go check out guys and good
luck for everything and I hope the tech
alchemist video will be amazing i’m sure
will be amazing so let’s do it thanks so much thank you thanks a lot
tech alchemist and today with me we r 3
is the first time we are free and I’m
here with Chris Johnson and jazz amor
from simply feem hi guys how are you
okay good to be with you so I normally
the tech alchemist interviews are a
split screen interview so it’s very easy
I talk or the gas stoke but in 3 i’m
sure we’ll we’ll create a big Kells but
we’ll try our best because the topic was
so so interesting and so many people are
asking about help tips and advices to
create better demo videos demo videos so
I as tech alchemist community knows I
love to talk about product or services
or company that I’m testing or that i’ve
been using or that i used in the past
and simplify i’m i’m working with you
guys and I’m very happy about it until
this moment and we try to create a demo
video for the tech alchemist so it’s
very interesting for me to see also
behind the scenes how it works what what
what is required to create a created my
video and I thought was a very good to
share this kind of knowledge with the
tech alchemist community because a lot
of good stuff here so first of all that
the main question is demo videos are
everywhere can we explain in 30 seconds
what is a demo video and why are we
start to see demo videos everywhere in
the web who get the question I’ll go for
it here a demo videos a way to get a
user to understand what your product
does really really fast and it makes
them hopefully it makes them feel like
they’re actually using the product and
the goal of a demo video is to convey
the specifics the honest truth of what
your product does in a light that makes
it easy to understand and why we’re
seeing on the web is too it’s a very
succinct effective way to get a message
across you don’t have to read a whole
ton of copy you can figure out what a
website or an app or a service or
whatever it is does fast
right I just go straight to the point
and I tell you why I decided to to go
with simply film so you have a real
customer feedback with the real reason
why a person or company decided to go
with a company like you I was going
around and I mean for the last 15 years
have been watching tones of demo videos
of all kind of companies and when I
decided to create tech alchemist video I
was sick and tired about this cartoonish
demo videos with with the animation of a
kind of Simpson style cartoon I thought
gosh I don’t know if it works I have no
idea but I’m tired and I think it’s
boring III don’t know what’s really not
coming when I arrived no simple film I
read some paper some reasons behind the
fact that this is not the way to go and
I would like to to literally talk about
it because I think it’s very interesting
well alleged agent talk about metaphors
in just a second but we call them that
this is dumb videos you know this is dog
dog has a problem now there’s an app it
solves the problem and they don’t work
there kind of sending I mean we want to
make sure that we indicate that the
company that we’re working with his high
quality and that’s why Jason builds a
metaphor as opposed to just those blobby
stupid cartoon characters that don’t
work on what he does so we we would
never make the same video well did Jason
can talk about that who never make the
same video over and over again well I
think I’ll first just start by saying
that while cartoon characters have sort
of at a history as being spokespeople
for products or whatever in the
advertising industry we’ve largely moved
away from you know things like the Jolly
Green Giant and in those sorts of you
know the Pillsbury Doughboy although I
guess he’s still around but i think that
people may not take your product
seriously if there’s a cartoon pitching
it and it just in the kind of the
creative economy that we’re in now and
so we’re really big fans of using
metaphor which is sort of a tangible way
of expressing abstract
ideas or thoughts or to take something
that’s a little bit hard you know taking
your software that you know very well
and you spend a lot of time in that’s
that’s a lot to buy it off and so
through you know some sort of a visual
image or metaphor we’re able to convey a
whole lot of information and not very
much time in a way that sticks the thing
I love about metaphor is that when you
use a metaphor and you encounter that
metaphor again later on away from the
website it it creates recall so you
think about the video that you saw when
you re encounter that metaphor for a
second time right also because my
feeling about cartoons is that or I mean
your brand I’m thinking about MailChimp
for instance or brand that have had a
cartoon inside their logo is part of
their their image their brand then maybe
it makes sense otherwise you see a brand
and then you see a cartoon that has
nothing to do with with the brand the
dog that the crib all was talking about
and then you think well what the hell is
DS I mean I’m not a 3 years old kid I
don’t guys what do you think about it
well it works for mailchimp but we have
they have a character this is an asset
that they were using again what we think
you know these one-off generic cartoon
characters that are just totally
interchangeable don’t work because it’s
it’s just saying hey we’re a tech
company too and there’s absolutely no
creativity behind out those creations
right and it’s I think the difference
with like a company like male chip is
that the chimp is built into the name of
their company I mean in a sense they’re
using that as almost a visual metaphor
where a lot of companies use cartoon
characters and videos it’s sort of just
tacked on at the end it really has
nothing to do with their product and as
Chris said it chris said earlier we
don’t like to make the same video over
and over and a lot of those cartoon
style videos it’s the same characters
over and over you slap a different logo
on the end of it but it’s really not
about the company it’s about the video
you’re buying it so if we do our job
right at simple phone we want to be
invisible we want to inherit the
properties of your company take on your
look we want to be kind of invisible at
it and you know a lot of the companies
out there that are using kind of the
cartoon approach really are the style
that they created is more about them
than their customers at least that’s
sort of our feeling yeah we want to
inherit and enhance the properties in
the design assets that are already built
so if you’ve got a book you know
best-selling book or a you know instead
of creative work we want to take what
you’ve already built and then and then
take that further into motion graphics
net the difference between us and some
of our competitors we don’t you know
we’re not the same companies as they are
they have different philosophies when
our philosophy it’s just to take what
you’ve done and translate and enhance it
okay no III standard general vision
about videos and do you think a demo
video so videos that explain product
service or a book or something are good
for any kind of industry or there are
industry where you say no guys you
better stop popping videos probably are
not the right way to to explain what’s
your feedback about well I would say
when Chris and I first started working
together I would regularly say to him I
don’t care what story it is I’ll tell
any story I think I think that if you it
matters how you approach a video i think
if you tell you have to create stories i
think that’s what draws people in and i
think that well i’ll just say I’ve not
encountered an industry at that you
can’t tell you can’t find a way to tell
a story if you’re only trying to present
the product and the facts of the product
and the features and there’s no that’s
why we love metaphors of metaphor sort
of incorporate story into the overall
video the idea is that there’s a
beginning middle and end and that over
the course of that there’s sort of a
narrative and it’s not like creating a
you know like a little mini movie or a
mini with the cartoon characters but it
is there sort of a visual narrative
that happens and I feel like that can
apply to really any industry out there
now Chris may have a different different
take on that but that’s I think where I
would land on that yeah I’ll say that
there’s there’s certainly industries and
businesses that it’s not cost-effective
to get you know a simple film where I
you know that a premium explainer video
type of treatment you know there’s some
things that you should just do slides
there should there are some times where
you should just do a screencast so I’m
not going to tell you that that
everybody who gets a video is going to
make money it’s a case by case basis if
you have a product that has a scale
people following you’re trying to either
activate your followers or build
awareness then it makes sense but if
you’re if you’re if you’re not at the
right size and then you know it’s a
force fit it doesn’t make sense well
another thing one other thing I would
just add to that is that we have on
occasion begun to work with a client and
realize that that we can’t tell the
story they want to tell or they want to
tell a story that’s sort of outside of
our wheelhouse or they want sort of a
glorified PowerPoint you know glorified
PowerPoint file and really we want to
work with clients that want to tell
stories and tell stories well and so I
wouldn’t say that I’m encountering an
industry that it doesn’t work for but we
have encountered clients on a few
occasions that that don’t see the vision
for where we want to help take them and
that’s okay there’s no you know there’s
room for many companies out there so
that you know there’s lots of stuff we
consider ourselves to be more artists
rather than technicians and a lot of
people want us to just do their
paint-by-numbers animation and that’s
just not something that we’re into yeah
also after you’ve been working on the
tech alchemist the benchmark is so high
and it’s so beautiful to work with me
that is difficult to work with any other
company I understand this but ok I hope
you’ll try to find hey we’re gonna we’re
gonna put you in our mission statement
from here on out so we’re done I mean
we’ve we’re not even gonna bother going
after Apple we’ve got you you know what
do we need um let’s stay on them
on this side I I was um curious too I
was always thinking that a great video
is and this is my by the ways my I’m
fully convinced about it that a great
video is in 2012 and in the next year’s
will be unbelievable powerful online so
if i see i don’t know someone writing a
post and i create a video i have a
totally different impact on the audience
so it’s so important but on the other
side are just a few days ago I saw these
stats about Facebook sharing and a
simple static image looks like is being
shared a much more than a video so I was
I don’t know I was not really convinced
about it also you know you have tone
source or stats in about this but in
your opinion I mean it the video you
know viral video is what people is
talking about but on social media do you
see that video are the most effective
form or you have evidence that maybe I
don’t know images or a different form ax
can work better well Wow one thing I
would say is I i think that people tend
to want to say way too much so the thing
about sharing images that’s very easy as
it doesn’t take very it’s not much of a
time investment so you look at an image
and you you know get your laugh out of
it you and you share that or whatever
we’re pretty we wrestle a little bit
sometimes with our clients because they
want to make a you know five minute
video or something like that people just
want invest the time in it so I again I
think story is important if you have a
great story to tell if it’s visually
interesting there’s a sense of mystery
or intrigue like where is this going to
go and you keep it short I feel like
those are the kind of videos that get
passed a lot around a whole lot more
than then watching some sort of a you
know a long diatribe kind of trailer you
know you want to make sure that you when
you make a video you want to make sure
that you don’t give people enough
information to say no I don’t want it
you want
try to get under their skin so you know
our image is going to share fat spread
faster than videos yeah probably but a
video can get under your skin you know
you you have to see this movie you have
to buy this app is this that you have a
hole in your soul that you have to fill
and you know if we do the video right it
creates a need and it creates an ache
for you know they miss this product I
wish they had a product like every other
like you know like what I no headway
themes or whatever we’ve you know reps
before that that’s that’s the desire
that a video is hoping you know we hope
to create create another thing that was
really intriguing me about simplifying
the first time that I came on the
website probably I i arrived at to you
guys because I I sudas this trailer from
Ryan Holliday the confessions of a media
manipulator and I I thought gosh this is
an amazing video you know and kind of
Hollywood since ET style and I thought
amazing it will cost I don’t know
$50,000 I don’t know it looks like
really you know Hollywood production and
I think this is also another point you
know probably if you can keep the course
that is not a Hollywood production and
you can bring quality videos to two
companies for demo videos then probably
company will start to embrace and I
think you started this trend and I think
it’s very interesting what do you think
I think I wish you would have been in
one sign of the check if you thought it
was worth 50,000 yeah so it’s kind of
price ceilings for stuff even a
best-selling book I don’t think it makes
much sense to spend more than ten or
fifteen thousand dollars on a video i
don’t think the ROI you know works above
that too well i think that it’s you know
you want to send a strong signal that
your quality but if you’re spending 25
30 thousand powers it doesn’t it’s not
going to pay back even if the video it’s
a million views and it does you know
those as well as like throw in holiday
with us if you know so you got to just
realize that and be respectful to the
industries and the people that you’re
working with we want to make the nexus
video we can so that for the lowest
price possible
and that’s always a constant battle
because crying you know costs money and
if we had more time we’d always be able
to do more stuff but we have to get
stuff done and keep it moving uh on a
regular basis right to the you
anticipated a question that I always
have in my mind the right cost today
2012 for a good quality demo video so is
if you have to give a range of price for
business will want to have a demo video
the industry i say i’m not telling
specifically about sympathy well there’s
there’s kind of two ways to go about it
between 0 and a thousand dollars that’s
a pretty safe and low-risk way to get a
video done and if that’s a that’s a good
decision for a lot of people you know
get a five-hundred-dollar video or a you
know get somebody to help you with some
styles for a low-end they’re just kind
of a real big no-man’s land between like
110 thousand dollars where you’re going
to get a lot of different kinds of
quality and a lot of the same video is
going to get made you’re not gonna be
original you’re not going to stand out
and then you know if you spend too much
doesn’t make sense so i would say that a
good quality demo video would be between
10 and say twenty five thousand dollars
for a 90-second ish piece can give or
take a few seconds and if you’ve got
some assets already built for design
work already done that may change the
fraser influence it that way right
although on the creative side of
creating a video producing a video i was
curious to understand in your experience
I mean you’re doing only animation so
spare
graphic effects and so on or do you
think also it makes sense when you
storytelling a video to introduce also I
know real people interviews Faye real
faces or you just choose animation
because you think is the most effective
way to go what was the reason behind it
that’s a great question i think we at
simplify them haven’t done anything with
life on-camera talent i think that that
can work part of it for us is that I
think that we know it’s our niche you
know we know that we can do that very
well it’s also pretty exciting you know
it’s it’s something that not everyone
can do it just has that additional edge
I think animation does that that sets
you apart a little bit from from video
because even a novice can pick up the
camera and you know I mean there are
certainly an art to cinematography and
lighting and that sort of thing but not
everyone can can animate you know that
sort of thing so I feel like animation
creates that kind of sticking power that
people want I mean that the Ryan holiday
trailer you talked about I saw a lot of
reactions to that like wow I didn’t see
that coming or you know doing a giant
media octopus or whatever is there’s
something more visually intriguing about
that than simply hearing the author
safety words about his book or her book
you know so I don’t know it just gives
that sort of extra something I think
that keeps people plugged in the other
thing about animation from a business
perspective which is um if you change
your product if you change something you
don’t have to recreate the whole set
reach we create everything if you learn
get some insight that says customers
want this instead of that it’s possible
to do a drop in and to recreate a scene
you don’t have to throw away your whole
animation so if you get rid of a feature
or add a feature or you know add an
integration you can just add it to the
animation later so it’s a lot more
flexible than a live-action dollar for
dollar now I’m going to be when I say
that simple phone probably will
eventually get into some live action so
that will probably do that when we can
be
good as we are at it at you know as we
are an animation we want to be the best
in the world no exceptions and we’re
getting there in animation want to get
there you know in the live-action side
when we can really compete and remember
when we have something to say when it’s
time for us to do that we’ll go and tell
stories in whatever medium we need to
tell stories in if I could just add what
if I could just have one other thought
especially with our book trailers the
idea is that we want to make that cover
of that book or that world sort of come
to life and that’s hard to do with just
someone sitting in front of a camera so
we again trying to inherit the
properties of whatever software we’re
doing or whatever company story we’re
dealing or whatever author whatever book
we’re telling the story for it so we
want everything in that trailer from the
time you it begins so the time it ends
to sort of feel like you’ve lived in
that world for a minute and a half let’s
talk now about the process um I’m
leaving I’m uh I’m a process you know
I’m living on my own my skin I have your
your stuff on my my head every day you
know about all the steps to follow mark
oh you already did this but you have to
give feedback on the script and the
voice and everything so is when I
started I I didn’t think it was so well
structured so that the process to arrive
to create a video because I was used you
know to get someone who just give me an
O prototype and say yeah you like this
no let’s change maybe the call or you
know but you follow a much more
structure structure and I think most a
more effective way can you maybe create
or or jasmine can you explain a little
bit better what are the most important
steps in the process of creating a demo
video well setting expectations from my
end is the most important part so you
know you you know what to expect you
know what’s going to happen now you know
it’s going to happen next that’s that’s
gonna my end because that’s how I run
the that part of a friend experience
along with Dennis our Directorate
details
we want to make sure that you understand
exactly what’s happened was about to
happen and what you need to do at
anything from for our respective cases
from my perspective I usually come in
after after the script has been
completed and our scripts normally don’t
have a lot of visual cues it will have
occasionally wats and stuff that will do
uh but my job is to somehow it take that
script and interpret it visually and one
of the things I think is the worst thing
you can do as as a video storyteller is
to start at the computer because I feel
like what you end up with something
that’s really neat my candy but it
doesn’t really tell a story so you’ve
got pretty colors or neat effects or
whatever but you’re not really focused
on the kind of the creative aspects of
storytelling and how you keep the viewer
engaged so I will step away from the
computer sometimes and I’ll spend a day
or maybe I shouldn’t say I step away
from the computer but I step away from
my animation tools and I’ll go out and
look at what inspires me I’ll try and
look for references just what looks hot
what doesn’t and sometimes it’ll be two
days of just trying to get my head
around what this thing is before I ever
begin animating so that approach is very
different than an approach where the
backgrounds always the same aim where
the characters are always the same or
whatever again we at some of them we
really try to make our videos seamless
so from the moment it begins to the
moment it ends the cameras are tracking
along and we’re telling the story
without breaks we want to keep the
viewer engaged all the way and then
again the use of metaphor is pretty
consistent that we’re always trying to
find visual ways like the mountains that
start off in the beginning of your video
that sort of look like a chart but it’s
also a mountain you know it’s just a an
interesting visual that kind of keep
people engaged in story right by the way
my surname is montemagno among the means
mountain so this is an additional tape
that you want to know what I tell you so
it’s very interesting cool no
we did we research that for a long time
we research that but on curbs every
night service simply film spies around
my house yes right right can we sum up
so the most important steps when
creating a good demo video so collecting
all the data about products services if
one step setting the right expectations
writing a script so writing a story that
makes sense and then start to creating
the animation choosing the voice this is
another point I will do a very stupid
question but I was always thinking about
that it does it perform better a Boys
and male voice of female voice it really
depends by the the project do you have
any stats or your experience about that
is it takes you in a direction another
well it depends on the product for sure
you know that’s something that’s fairly
easy and fairly inexpensive and
straightforward to test out sometimes it
doesn’t make any difference at all so
that’s that’s probably in fifty percent
of cases it doesn’t make a lot of
difference whether it’s a male voice or
female voice it’s a matter of taste and
preference and how you want to support
the brand sometimes a male voice will
outperform the female voice even when it
seems to be behind so like if if a video
um I think it was yes where that the
female voice people watched to the video
till the end more than the male but
people bought the product more from the
male even though they only watched half
the video and so that’s a success right
i mean that’s a win if you get people to
convert because of the video that that
you have so um that’s something that
it’s you know Wistia and there’s a
number of other tools that make it
fairly straightforward to test different
video objects and you want to do a fair
amount of that you don’t want to assess
over because um you know want to create
you want to you don’t want to create
another job for yourself but you want to
take a look at it and see and if you
know if you have a strong feeling and
you want to represent your brand a
certain way that’s the way to go right I
mean if you don’t have a preference than
something testing maybe something you
try to do and we’re pretty careful about
the voices we choose to
we try to make sure that if if you got a
more corporate client we get somewhere
that sounds a little more
straightforward corporate we’ve got our
we’ve got a go-to guy for young and hip
you know we’ve got we’ve got our go-to
people for different styles and there
been a time there’s been a time or two I
think that we’ve cast a voice that
wasn’t quite the right fit and have even
gone back to any pre recorded voices
read after realizing that maybe we
didn’t have the right one in there does
voiceover work makes a huge difference
I’ve been given to choose several voices
and one was very sexy like Angelina
Jolie and I immediately say yeah I want
this one and then you’re then it’s a no
way is not good for the tech alchemist
and you gave me guys I don’t know a man
like Sean Connery I did it but okay good
no that’s excellent um about converting
um this is our dough interesting point
so a video that convert this is in the
end the goal I think to have a video
that bring a result not only that people
say oh this is a nice video what are the
metrics that you try to look to
understand if a video convert or not
well I think it’s important to show the
actual product or a sec similarly the
product you know showing people that
they really have something here rather
than than you know showing a phone with
with things bursting out of it showing
the screens of the of the product that
is an engineered and built and an
intentional product it’s going to go a
long way to make people more comfortable
because then they’re going to say oh
this is a real thing this isn’t just
somebody’s fantasy and I can see this
right here and then what I can use that
if you like to detective stuff in these
heels and I get this thing so that’s the
young that that’s my gut feeling and
when we’ve done more and more showing
the product the customer feedback will
be very active for us we also sometimes
hear from our clients that there excuse
me their sales increase one of our
clients said that they their sales trip
day after three put our video out also I
feel like we have a lot of repeat
clients
and right while we don’t hear specific
numbers um we’re pretty certain that
they’re converting their video to
customers or they would be coming back
to us we’re not cheap and they can pay
us a couple of times so you know that
said something to do they say right yeah
right just a must oh ok a couple of
question um how long it takes to create
a good demo video to give a business
listening to us so how long is the right
timing to create a good demo videos and
what’s the best length for a demo video
good question for us it takes about 150
hours of animation 100 250 hours of
animation we’re big fans of the minute
to a minute and a half timeline we think
there are diminishing returns the more
that you go past a minute and a half
viewers just don’t hang that long Chris
can probably talk more about the process
free video but we’ve got about 150 hours
of animation yeah as far as like time
that it takes you know in for the
business person o’carroll hours we spend
but but I’m going to say that generally
from from when you send your contract
and deposit to us to delivery it’s
anywhere between six weeks when we’re
fast and and everything works right in
that there’s not a lot of revisions to
12 to 15 weeks if it takes a while to
get there what what why not happening is
that we don’t get feedback back from
clients and we kind of get stuck so if a
client doesn’t have you know you need
some feedback back you know if you don’t
have an approval on this particular
section and we’re stuck um we’re
stopping we can’t move forward so you
know we don’t want to lose three days we
go we ship to another project whatever
we have to do to to keep the key bars
not moving because our animators you
know Jason and his team are not cheap
either and that we want to make sure
that they’re working so um the client
can really influence it by you know
making it easy getting assets to us
their logos their their animations there
in all other stock from assets and
getting us also the oh the approvals on
a timely fashion on in a timely fashion
that’s why we keep harassing me the best
legs I was like 70 or 75 seconds because
after you know we’ve seen the numbers
and its ear you know we don’t it it’s
seriously erodes fast after you know
after 70 or so seconds people abandon it
even if they’re well-intentioned because
you know the longer you stay doing one
thing the more risk there is of doing
something else right so um that makes
sense you know you’re doing one thing
and your phone could ring your boss can
come in your dog could want to go
outside and you’re watching a video you
can get yep you get pulled away from
this we want to get the message out
there underman and a hat for sure and
the other thing is I feel like the video
is really just meant to be an invitation
into the door so we’re not trying to say
everything there is to say about the
video we there are still things that
would be communicated on the website um
could be things that are communicated in
print you know could be think that a
Salesman might share with you but the
video is really meant to sort of create
a level of comfort you know welcome into
our world come in have a seat you know
we’ll share the rest of it with you in
in a different formula final question
guys and then I to go what’s the best
tip that you can give to a company that
want to have a demo video if you just
want it what would you recommend hire us
for next year alligator my one tip would
be less is more don’t try to say
everything pick one or two or three
things and go with the drunk don’t you
are in love with your software or your
product or your book or whatever but the
people that you’re talking to that
you’re trying to reach are not yet in
love with it and they don’t care about
everything so one or two or three things
are going to do a whole lot more for you
than trying to save more than that no I
would I would say that probably you want
to try to
make a script that gets under their skin
and take some chances don’t try to say
everything don’t play it safe be bold
and and try to be daring with what
you’re doing if you’re in a marketplace
its competitive you want to stand out
and figure competition by being daring
by being specific and not being we’re
just another app like everybody else
this is doug doug has an app for his
iphone that doesn’t work be daring
excellent guys I have to stop here I I
stole so much time of you but the great
tips a lot of interesting stuff thank
you so much as a more Chris Johnson
simply film go check out guys and good
luck for everything and I hope the tech
alchemist video will be amazing i’m sure
will be amazing so let’s do it thanks so much thank you thanks a lot
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