hey guys do you like breakdowns if your
favorite shows check out our new show
watch club where we break down shows
like West world and some of your other
favorites enjoy hello everybody and
welcome to watch club the show where we
break down the biggest shows on
television I am your host Matt and
Phoebe joins me as per usual Phoebe how
are you doing I’m very well are you
ready to talk about the season finale of
Westworld ready excellent
so just to fill you guys in it was
season 2 episode 10 it was titled the
passenger it was written by Jonathan
Nolan and Lisa joy and was directed by
Frederick II Oh toy so Before we jump in
to the episode let’s just talk about the
season for a little bit what we thought
of it as a whole I know you weren’t
maybe 100 percent impressed yeah I think
that the general consensus is that there
were like a lot of really like hot
moments in this season but there were
also like a lot of really like cold sort
of boring episodes my personal favorite
episode as you know was the episode of
the key cheetah yes that was so yeah
definitely like the high point of the
season and I really enjoyed it however I
think there were a lot of episodes that
just sort of dragged on I feel like a
lot of the conflict took place inside of
the characters heads so there wasn’t
actually much going on which I found
really really frustrating interesting
yeah I would agree with you that kicks
wheel was my favorite episode of the
whole season so far or so far it’s done
what I meant to say was of the whole
series but it’s interesting because when
we talked about that episode the
comments didn’t necessarily agree they
thought it was kind of a slow burn
episode didn’t really add too much I
think the idea is that we kind of like
the heart and the emotion behind that
story or as that kind of took people out
of it so I thought that was interesting
I wouldn’t say that it was a
disappointing season I did enjoy it it
did have a lot of high moments a lot of
twists and turns and I thought most of
the payoffs did pay off in fact and I
loved the inclusion of dello senior we
we found out a bit more about Logan’s
story as well so I thought those were
nice little touches is it better than
the first season that’s a tough question
for me I’m not sure I think they’re
right up there with each other
I think the reveals were
in this season it obviously expanded the
story and is bringing it outside of West
wrote for season three so I think they
did a good job at that I think my issue
with it was that the first season had
such an interesting storyline for the
main characters and in this season as
you even mentioned we get all of these
secondary characters who have more of an
interesting narrative than the mains do
right which I found really frustrating
because Delores you know it’s such an
amazing character and I understand that
her characters sort of took a dark turn
and I thought that was really
interesting but I felt that the way that
it was executed was just so
self-indulgent and there’s a lot of
repetition in you know the things that
she was doing and the things that she
was saying and I felt it was all very
predictable okay I’m in my opinion
however I do agree with you that the
inclusion of you know more Logan more
dello senior was really interesting it
was a really good turn for the show
however I felt that the secondary
characters shown a lot more than than
the main characters did okay that’s fair
so let’s jump into the season finale it
was a big one it was an hour and a half
long so basically feature-length and
there was one post-credit scene and
there was almost two because the end of
the episode I felt when it’s Dolores as
Charlotte escaping a finally Westworld I
felt that was like the perfect ending
but then it jumps into this situation
where we weren’t really sure if it was
the past it was the present or the
future when they when when Dolores was
interviewing Bernard yeah and we find
out that that’s the most up-to-date
point in this whole story and I thought
that was one of my favorite moments
because we find out they’re finally in
the real world yeah yeah
I don’t usually thought that was like a
really powerful scene because we were
under the impression I think a lot of
people are under the impression that
this was all happening you know either
like in the cradle or in a previous
timeline yeah and to find out that it
was all sort of happening in the now was
really cool and you see them in this
environment and you even see you know
Bernard exploring the home that is
technically his like going outside into
the real world for the first time I
thought that was like the most exciting
part of the episode totally aside from
obviously the charlotte reveal which I
think for me was like a really
hi moment of this episode yes I agree
yeah and I was always like I’m very not
not confused but I’m interested to see
what those fears were that Dolores
brought out we know that one of them was
obviously Bernard yeah because he was
recreating in the real world and we
might assume that one of them might be
the other Charlotte character because we
see Dolores Charlotte’s there as well
yeah but it can’t be Charlotte we’ll
talk about that a little bit later those
were some of my favorite moments and
also you know Westworld is super popular
for being extremely confusing yeah
having a lot of storylines that
eventually interconnect and kind of make
sense but in this episode I would say
that the the simpler storylines were the
ones that I connected with the most or
at least enjoyed a bit more so for
example when a key cheetah reunited with
his wife Cohen I thought that was
beautiful you know and Maeve actually
being able to save her daughter maybe
not in the way she was hoping to to be
reunited completely with her but at
least they end up in in that other
valley beyond kind of thing yeah I
thought that that was like a really
really cool set piece like the valley
beyond and the crack in the sky and how
they like it looked as if they were
jumping off the cliff but they were
actually doing so like what sort of look
like a windows screensaver like it was
public windows but it was really sweet
and like you know at the very end we
also see teddy there which I thought was
like you know it sort of seems like a
bit of a heavenly vibe if you knew it
right like yeah where West world is hell
for these people this is like their
their solace yes yeah and I thought the
whole cliff scene was actually very
interesting because you know the wind
Buffalo the Indians used to run Buffalo
off the cliff so you know it was their
way to hunt they were complete in
complete control I should say of how
these animals would die or where they
would run they just had complete control
of what would happen and it was kind of
similar as to the humans controlling all
these hosts but then in that moment it
was ironic because yes they do go over
the cliff but they’re actually in
control they know that they’re going to
a better place when doing this so I
thought that was pretty interesting
speaking of that one of my favorite
scenes with Maeve obviously I love maybe
girl and when she you know is
resurrected from her state of she’s
about to die essentially and she she
rises all the hosts they save her and
she’s walking and all of the Bulls are
running yes it was so powerful you also
see like a scene which is in the opening
credits where the bolt goes through the
glass and it’s falling like that exact
scene was mimicked in this episode which
I thought was really really powerful and
just like an amazing like piece like I
really enjoyed that part of the you know
okay yeah you were both a bit late so I
went ahead and saved myself so there’s
like a really interesting part in this
episode that I noticed was mimicking of
former episode and I know Wes world does
that a lot they have callbacks and stuff
yeah um so when we’re in the cradle and
we’re seeing Delos going through these
fidelity tests and it always ends at the
same point with him and Logan having
this confrontation and Logan tells us
that that is essentially the pinnacle of
who Delos senior was this is the point
that they always come to to make sure
you know that he always says the same
thing because that’s that defines who he
was as a person right in this scene
Logan says and I’m gonna read it here
I’m all the way down now I can see the
bottom don’t you want to see what I see
so actually Adela’s senior says this in
the episode where he’s being tested for
fidelity by William when he’s asking him
all these things write the full quote is
I’m all the way down I can see all the
way to the bottom would you like to see
what I see they said there were two
fathers one above one below they lied
there was only ever the devil so I
thought that that was like a really
really cool sort of callback yeah gets
that line from his son it’s really eerie
and it sort of mimics their situation
which i think is like a really really
interesting yeah sure yeah and it was
just like AI Logan was saying as well
you know it always just comes back to
that one point you can have a million
different paths and you can hope that it
brings you it brings you to a different
end point but it’s always gonna bring
you to the same spot exactly and that’s
the one yeah and it’s interesting one of
my favorite moments not favorite moments
but and it’s not even necessarily
something you missed but when Lee
was with with Maeve and Hector and it
seems like they’re all about to die
because Dallas is closing in on them and
Hector looks at maybe he’s like I’m
gonna take care of them you guys run you
need to take care of this and he’s about
to start this big triumphant speech that
clearly Lee is written for him in the
past in his storyline and as he’s about
to do it this like big dramatic music
comes up and then all of a sudden it
just kind of you know like cartoon Lee
with Lee grabbing him and pulling him
back and he’s like you know what she’s
gonna need your help I’m gonna take care
of this you guys get away and I just
thought like it’s so beautiful because
he wrote basically Hector as the man he
always wanted to be and he never thought
that he would have liked that kind of
honorable context was life I guess but
then in this moment he becomes Hector
you know he becomes a hero and he he
does become the man he’s always strived
to to become and he goes out and he
sacrifices himself and I thought that
was so heartbreaking but also super
funny because Lee’s kind of like the
comedic relief in all this but it was
honorable it was it was a beautiful
sacrifice and I thought that was really
cool how it came back to the the story
he wrote what I really liked about like
Lee’s character is that he’s always been
the comedic relief and I think it we got
a lot of moments in this season where we
see him in a different light and we see
him you know more sad or like regretful
and I think that that sort of lost its
charm for me and then it all comes full
circle and he does something so heroic
and it sort of incorporates the
dimensions of his personality like he
has the capacity to be a more emotional
person but he also has a capacity to be
like really funny and I thought that
that was like the perfect combination of
the two to say goodbye to his character
yeah
angry you sleep on the broken bodies
before you yourselves so we talked about
some of our favorite moments but let’s
just dive a bit deeper into the episode
itself did you like it did you think it
was great did it live up to the hype of
being a season finale in your eyes yeah
I honestly could not connect with this
episode like I really I really was
excited to find out I thought the big
twist was going to be like while the
hosts were floating in the water and
while it did sort of rectify that it
didn’t
give me that shock that I thought it
would it was sort of an obvious turn for
the storyline and they had played that
up a lot right dolly flooding and then
in the end it just ends up being because
yeah the because the the base flooded
yeah which I thought was a little very
easy way to tie up that storyline yeah
it also never explained why Teddy was
there like I thought that that was kind
of weird like there was never that we
didn’t really get any concrete answers
to that question although I think
because it seemed like the whole valley
had flooded or at least like a large
portion of it so maybe we’re just safe
to assume that he was swept up and like
some tide and brought in with all the
other hosts but it’s true like why would
he be smack dab in the middle at all of
it just felt so weird because they put
so much emphasis on that and then where
Teddy committed suicide seemed so far
removed from where yeah the main action
in this story took place that I could
like it was sort of a stretch and sort
of like a like an untied not right and I
thought that was really frustrating yeah
there were a few good reveals towards
the end of the episode but it took so
long to get there I really just didn’t
connect with it at all I I was gonna say
I kind of agree that the whole valley
flooding was maybe it was clearly like a
red herring almost but they kind of made
up worked with the whole fact that
Bernard actually devised all of this
stuff himself and not necessarily with
Ford and the whole Charlotte
dolorous reveal was pretty it was pretty
amazing yeah not to say that that wasn’t
like a crazy reveal because I was
definitely shocked like my mouth was
like why don’t ya I totally didn’t
expect that it definitely came out of
left field I just felt like it didn’t
give me the payoff that I wanted have
from having watched the entire season
you know with such a close I had been
like waiting for that big moment for a
big like season finale and it just it
didn’t give me what I what I thought I
wanted yeah okay I I mean that’s fair I
would say that I definitely enjoyed it
it maybe didn’t have the same kind of
grandiosity if you will as the season
finale in the first one yeah but they
did leave a lot of questions open
leading up to that episode and I think
they did do a pretty nice job of timing
or tying up all the loose ends
and setting up season 3 will really well
the thing I didn’t kind of like I
touched upon it before when when Dolores
/ disguised as Charlotte leaves the
leaves the west-world
I thought that was like the perfect
ending and almost seemed like there were
two post-credit scenes really because
the scene with with Dolores and Bernard
discussing that there in the real world
now it totally made sense to have but it
did seem that kind of like they had run
out of time and they had to do
post-credit scenes yeah a lot of film
directors nowadays kind of say like oh
you know if you need post-credit scenes
that means you didn’t achieve what you
wanted in the movie and I kind of feel
that with this episode but at the same
time their scenes you really needed
especially the one with the man in black
at the end to kind of leaving it up in
the air whether he’s a host or not yeah
that was definitely like really cool and
what I don’t really understand is why
there was a need for a post-credits
scene they had an hour and a half times
and everything done and I felt like
there were a lot of scenes that could
have been shortened they could have been
generated those storylines into the
actual episode it felt like it was
really frustrating that there was so
much happening right at the end and
everything was happening right at the
end but there was an hour before where
it was just sort of like a regular
episode of watch yeah and that’s I agree
with you totally on that point but you
know like audiences loved that stuff you
know Marvel there’s 3 / 3 post-credit
scenes sometimes it’s just something
that the public really likes so I
understand why they did it but I agree
it does feel like if you can put it in a
post-credits scene just throw it in in
the episode yeah and not to say that
people shouldn’t like this episode I
think it does it does have a lot of
value and it does definitely leave a lot
to be desired for season 3 yeah I just
think for me like I wanted more from the
last episode I mean that’s fair um but I
am really excited to see what they do in
season 3 now that they’re in the real
world so let’s talk about predictions
really quickly I’m gonna talk about the
man in black whether or not he’s a host
or not I know you want to touch upon
something about that after I give my but
we had been we you know we’ve been
playing around with the idea that the
man in black was a host for a few
episodes now our co-host Rebecca had
brought it up when you were
unfortunately not with us and a lot of
the comments were like no there’s no way
this is ridiculous it’s a stupid idea
they’ve already done the whole human as
a host reveal already and I totally
agree with that but the way this season
was going they were clearly laying on
thick the hints that he was really a
host and I don’t think anyone can really
deny that and then the post-credits
scene basically almost proves that he is
a host or is he so this is a thing even
earlier in the episode after he’s cut up
his arm you don’t see whether or not
there’s a bunch of like wires or gears
or blood and veins in there it’s covered
up but at the end of the episode he sees
his daughter and then she starts
questioning him for fidelity as well so
then we’re all left to believe oh my god
he is a host because why else would they
be doing these tests but my opinion is I
know I’ve been saying that he is a host
for a little while he probably isn’t
because my prediction is at the end of
the episode Delos finds him they’re like
oh he’s in really rough shape he’s
passed out he’s lost his hand he’s lost
a ton of blood so he’s clearly
unconscious and I think that the fact
that he was struggling with with his
identity and whether or not he was a
host or a human or not while he’s passed
out he’s just having these
hallucinations and these dreams of his
daughter kind of questioning his being
so I think that’s that’s my prediction
it’ll be too on-the-nose
if he is a host but I know you want to
jump in and say something quickly about
that that’s a pretty deep cut do you
think however I’ve been doing my
research and since the episode is aired
a co-creator at least a joy has been
doing a lot of really insightful
interviews I think to sort of help
people wrap their minds around things
see I kind of try to avoid those just to
avoid spoilers a little bit but if it
provides insight yeah I know it I think
I think it more provides insight then
then it is a spoiler brace and three
okay um
when asked about that post-credit scene
with the man in black I think a lot of
people are sort of going crazy about
that yeah she said that that happens in
the far far future so I have a really
interesting prediction and you sort of
have to just like bear with me at this
point there are layers okay it’s late
opinion so basically in this episode we
see that Logan is testing his father for
fidelity
in the cradle so essentially they’re
going through the same scenario they’re
always ending up at the same point where
this point in Delos seniors journey is
the defining moment of his life
yes so obviously when the men in black
kills his daughter earlier in the season
yep that is the defining moment for him
so basically my prediction is that that
that scene is taking place in the far
far future where he is a host he had not
been before okay he is now a host
because he maybe died something happened
to him he became a host and they created
a host version of his daughter to test
for fidelity interests it would be
really similar to what’s like the
storyline with Logan and his father yeah
versus her and her father Lee yeah and
the defining moment in that test would
be him killing his daughter because
that’s the decision that he would make
every time Wow
so it is like an onion there’s a lot of
layers here it makes sense it totally
makes sense and with it being Westworld
who knows it could be true I mean twisty
and turny that’s your your your research
is pretty good I will say that I’ll
touch upon a few other like quick
predictions that we can maybe just
bounce off at the end Stubbs as well has
the conversation with Dolores disguised
as Charlotte saying basically oh you
know the old man hired me himself way
back when I don’t even remember how long
ago it was so right there you’re kind of
like oh my god okay that’s interesting
and then he starts talking about his
core drive and who he has to be loyal to
and that he has to like take care of all
the hosts on the park and he’s looking
at Dolores the whole time kind of just
like almost with a knowing look you know
yeah and then in the end he lets her go
but I mean there is strong hints that
that Stubbs is a host no yeah I agree
with you there was that moment where he
said like something that alluded to the
fact that he knew that she wasn’t who
she is and she was active known that I
have no idea I think that’s sort of like
a host thing maybe yeah maybe the
network or so host yeah yeah yeah that
was a really weird scene I think about
his character deserve
more yeah more exposition at this point
like in season 3 because that was like a
really interesting turn yes I always
thought that he was just sort of like a
throwaway character but now it seems
that like he’s a host and yes he’s
sensing that she’s gone off into the
real world he’s the only one who knows
yeah yeah I don’t know if you guys
caught any hints to that but that
totally caught me off guard I almost
think it came like completely out of
left field
agreed yeah also we talked about this
previously but Dolores also smuggled
some some spheres out of the park so
what are the skiers is it information is
it dello secret top top secret stuff is
it just other hosts who knows yeah I
think there was a part at the very
beginning of the episode when Dolores is
embracing Teddy’s lifeless body and yes
he takes his sphere did we forget about
that because maybe Charlotte is Teddy
now who is who is Charlotte because we
know that it’s not to Dolores is because
we know yeah I don’t agree with she
reincarnated herself as Charlotte and
then she reincarnated herself as herself
and now we have Charlotte Bernard
and Dolores but you know it’s Charlotte
I think it might be Teddy I’m not sure
about I mean yeah I’m not sure because
she has his fear yeah and she implants
she implants it into the system and then
sends him to for lack of a better term
you know that the other Valley be yeah
and he’s there and he’s smiling and he’s
kind of at peace with himself so if he’s
there can he be in the reader no I mean
I think that would be really cool I
think that yeah it would be interesting
to have like a female relationship
because we know like you know Teddy and
doors are so many cool to sort of have
Charlotte and Dolores interrelationship
like that Charlotte actually being Teddy
yeah yeah that’s very interesting um I’m
not sure about that
yes it’ll happen I don’t know if you
guys think that’ll be that will happen
but if you have any predictions please
feel free to write them in the comments
so that sadly marks the end of season 2
West Worldwatch Club guys thank you so
much for taking this journey with us if
you want to watch more TV stuff and
movie stuff be sure to subscribe to the
channel
and that basically wraps it all up so
for myself and Phoebe thank you so much
for watching we’ll see you next time so
that’s our breakdown what do you guys
think let us know in the comments below
check out our other episodes here and
some of your other favorite shows right here
favorite shows check out our new show
watch club where we break down shows
like West world and some of your other
favorites enjoy hello everybody and
welcome to watch club the show where we
break down the biggest shows on
television I am your host Matt and
Phoebe joins me as per usual Phoebe how
are you doing I’m very well are you
ready to talk about the season finale of
Westworld ready excellent
so just to fill you guys in it was
season 2 episode 10 it was titled the
passenger it was written by Jonathan
Nolan and Lisa joy and was directed by
Frederick II Oh toy so Before we jump in
to the episode let’s just talk about the
season for a little bit what we thought
of it as a whole I know you weren’t
maybe 100 percent impressed yeah I think
that the general consensus is that there
were like a lot of really like hot
moments in this season but there were
also like a lot of really like cold sort
of boring episodes my personal favorite
episode as you know was the episode of
the key cheetah yes that was so yeah
definitely like the high point of the
season and I really enjoyed it however I
think there were a lot of episodes that
just sort of dragged on I feel like a
lot of the conflict took place inside of
the characters heads so there wasn’t
actually much going on which I found
really really frustrating interesting
yeah I would agree with you that kicks
wheel was my favorite episode of the
whole season so far or so far it’s done
what I meant to say was of the whole
series but it’s interesting because when
we talked about that episode the
comments didn’t necessarily agree they
thought it was kind of a slow burn
episode didn’t really add too much I
think the idea is that we kind of like
the heart and the emotion behind that
story or as that kind of took people out
of it so I thought that was interesting
I wouldn’t say that it was a
disappointing season I did enjoy it it
did have a lot of high moments a lot of
twists and turns and I thought most of
the payoffs did pay off in fact and I
loved the inclusion of dello senior we
we found out a bit more about Logan’s
story as well so I thought those were
nice little touches is it better than
the first season that’s a tough question
for me I’m not sure I think they’re
right up there with each other
I think the reveals were
in this season it obviously expanded the
story and is bringing it outside of West
wrote for season three so I think they
did a good job at that I think my issue
with it was that the first season had
such an interesting storyline for the
main characters and in this season as
you even mentioned we get all of these
secondary characters who have more of an
interesting narrative than the mains do
right which I found really frustrating
because Delores you know it’s such an
amazing character and I understand that
her characters sort of took a dark turn
and I thought that was really
interesting but I felt that the way that
it was executed was just so
self-indulgent and there’s a lot of
repetition in you know the things that
she was doing and the things that she
was saying and I felt it was all very
predictable okay I’m in my opinion
however I do agree with you that the
inclusion of you know more Logan more
dello senior was really interesting it
was a really good turn for the show
however I felt that the secondary
characters shown a lot more than than
the main characters did okay that’s fair
so let’s jump into the season finale it
was a big one it was an hour and a half
long so basically feature-length and
there was one post-credit scene and
there was almost two because the end of
the episode I felt when it’s Dolores as
Charlotte escaping a finally Westworld I
felt that was like the perfect ending
but then it jumps into this situation
where we weren’t really sure if it was
the past it was the present or the
future when they when when Dolores was
interviewing Bernard yeah and we find
out that that’s the most up-to-date
point in this whole story and I thought
that was one of my favorite moments
because we find out they’re finally in
the real world yeah yeah
I don’t usually thought that was like a
really powerful scene because we were
under the impression I think a lot of
people are under the impression that
this was all happening you know either
like in the cradle or in a previous
timeline yeah and to find out that it
was all sort of happening in the now was
really cool and you see them in this
environment and you even see you know
Bernard exploring the home that is
technically his like going outside into
the real world for the first time I
thought that was like the most exciting
part of the episode totally aside from
obviously the charlotte reveal which I
think for me was like a really
hi moment of this episode yes I agree
yeah and I was always like I’m very not
not confused but I’m interested to see
what those fears were that Dolores
brought out we know that one of them was
obviously Bernard yeah because he was
recreating in the real world and we
might assume that one of them might be
the other Charlotte character because we
see Dolores Charlotte’s there as well
yeah but it can’t be Charlotte we’ll
talk about that a little bit later those
were some of my favorite moments and
also you know Westworld is super popular
for being extremely confusing yeah
having a lot of storylines that
eventually interconnect and kind of make
sense but in this episode I would say
that the the simpler storylines were the
ones that I connected with the most or
at least enjoyed a bit more so for
example when a key cheetah reunited with
his wife Cohen I thought that was
beautiful you know and Maeve actually
being able to save her daughter maybe
not in the way she was hoping to to be
reunited completely with her but at
least they end up in in that other
valley beyond kind of thing yeah I
thought that that was like a really
really cool set piece like the valley
beyond and the crack in the sky and how
they like it looked as if they were
jumping off the cliff but they were
actually doing so like what sort of look
like a windows screensaver like it was
public windows but it was really sweet
and like you know at the very end we
also see teddy there which I thought was
like you know it sort of seems like a
bit of a heavenly vibe if you knew it
right like yeah where West world is hell
for these people this is like their
their solace yes yeah and I thought the
whole cliff scene was actually very
interesting because you know the wind
Buffalo the Indians used to run Buffalo
off the cliff so you know it was their
way to hunt they were complete in
complete control I should say of how
these animals would die or where they
would run they just had complete control
of what would happen and it was kind of
similar as to the humans controlling all
these hosts but then in that moment it
was ironic because yes they do go over
the cliff but they’re actually in
control they know that they’re going to
a better place when doing this so I
thought that was pretty interesting
speaking of that one of my favorite
scenes with Maeve obviously I love maybe
girl and when she you know is
resurrected from her state of she’s
about to die essentially and she she
rises all the hosts they save her and
she’s walking and all of the Bulls are
running yes it was so powerful you also
see like a scene which is in the opening
credits where the bolt goes through the
glass and it’s falling like that exact
scene was mimicked in this episode which
I thought was really really powerful and
just like an amazing like piece like I
really enjoyed that part of the you know
okay yeah you were both a bit late so I
went ahead and saved myself so there’s
like a really interesting part in this
episode that I noticed was mimicking of
former episode and I know Wes world does
that a lot they have callbacks and stuff
yeah um so when we’re in the cradle and
we’re seeing Delos going through these
fidelity tests and it always ends at the
same point with him and Logan having
this confrontation and Logan tells us
that that is essentially the pinnacle of
who Delos senior was this is the point
that they always come to to make sure
you know that he always says the same
thing because that’s that defines who he
was as a person right in this scene
Logan says and I’m gonna read it here
I’m all the way down now I can see the
bottom don’t you want to see what I see
so actually Adela’s senior says this in
the episode where he’s being tested for
fidelity by William when he’s asking him
all these things write the full quote is
I’m all the way down I can see all the
way to the bottom would you like to see
what I see they said there were two
fathers one above one below they lied
there was only ever the devil so I
thought that that was like a really
really cool sort of callback yeah gets
that line from his son it’s really eerie
and it sort of mimics their situation
which i think is like a really really
interesting yeah sure yeah and it was
just like AI Logan was saying as well
you know it always just comes back to
that one point you can have a million
different paths and you can hope that it
brings you it brings you to a different
end point but it’s always gonna bring
you to the same spot exactly and that’s
the one yeah and it’s interesting one of
my favorite moments not favorite moments
but and it’s not even necessarily
something you missed but when Lee
was with with Maeve and Hector and it
seems like they’re all about to die
because Dallas is closing in on them and
Hector looks at maybe he’s like I’m
gonna take care of them you guys run you
need to take care of this and he’s about
to start this big triumphant speech that
clearly Lee is written for him in the
past in his storyline and as he’s about
to do it this like big dramatic music
comes up and then all of a sudden it
just kind of you know like cartoon Lee
with Lee grabbing him and pulling him
back and he’s like you know what she’s
gonna need your help I’m gonna take care
of this you guys get away and I just
thought like it’s so beautiful because
he wrote basically Hector as the man he
always wanted to be and he never thought
that he would have liked that kind of
honorable context was life I guess but
then in this moment he becomes Hector
you know he becomes a hero and he he
does become the man he’s always strived
to to become and he goes out and he
sacrifices himself and I thought that
was so heartbreaking but also super
funny because Lee’s kind of like the
comedic relief in all this but it was
honorable it was it was a beautiful
sacrifice and I thought that was really
cool how it came back to the the story
he wrote what I really liked about like
Lee’s character is that he’s always been
the comedic relief and I think it we got
a lot of moments in this season where we
see him in a different light and we see
him you know more sad or like regretful
and I think that that sort of lost its
charm for me and then it all comes full
circle and he does something so heroic
and it sort of incorporates the
dimensions of his personality like he
has the capacity to be a more emotional
person but he also has a capacity to be
like really funny and I thought that
that was like the perfect combination of
the two to say goodbye to his character
yeah
angry you sleep on the broken bodies
before you yourselves so we talked about
some of our favorite moments but let’s
just dive a bit deeper into the episode
itself did you like it did you think it
was great did it live up to the hype of
being a season finale in your eyes yeah
I honestly could not connect with this
episode like I really I really was
excited to find out I thought the big
twist was going to be like while the
hosts were floating in the water and
while it did sort of rectify that it
didn’t
give me that shock that I thought it
would it was sort of an obvious turn for
the storyline and they had played that
up a lot right dolly flooding and then
in the end it just ends up being because
yeah the because the the base flooded
yeah which I thought was a little very
easy way to tie up that storyline yeah
it also never explained why Teddy was
there like I thought that that was kind
of weird like there was never that we
didn’t really get any concrete answers
to that question although I think
because it seemed like the whole valley
had flooded or at least like a large
portion of it so maybe we’re just safe
to assume that he was swept up and like
some tide and brought in with all the
other hosts but it’s true like why would
he be smack dab in the middle at all of
it just felt so weird because they put
so much emphasis on that and then where
Teddy committed suicide seemed so far
removed from where yeah the main action
in this story took place that I could
like it was sort of a stretch and sort
of like a like an untied not right and I
thought that was really frustrating yeah
there were a few good reveals towards
the end of the episode but it took so
long to get there I really just didn’t
connect with it at all I I was gonna say
I kind of agree that the whole valley
flooding was maybe it was clearly like a
red herring almost but they kind of made
up worked with the whole fact that
Bernard actually devised all of this
stuff himself and not necessarily with
Ford and the whole Charlotte
dolorous reveal was pretty it was pretty
amazing yeah not to say that that wasn’t
like a crazy reveal because I was
definitely shocked like my mouth was
like why don’t ya I totally didn’t
expect that it definitely came out of
left field I just felt like it didn’t
give me the payoff that I wanted have
from having watched the entire season
you know with such a close I had been
like waiting for that big moment for a
big like season finale and it just it
didn’t give me what I what I thought I
wanted yeah okay I I mean that’s fair I
would say that I definitely enjoyed it
it maybe didn’t have the same kind of
grandiosity if you will as the season
finale in the first one yeah but they
did leave a lot of questions open
leading up to that episode and I think
they did do a pretty nice job of timing
or tying up all the loose ends
and setting up season 3 will really well
the thing I didn’t kind of like I
touched upon it before when when Dolores
/ disguised as Charlotte leaves the
leaves the west-world
I thought that was like the perfect
ending and almost seemed like there were
two post-credit scenes really because
the scene with with Dolores and Bernard
discussing that there in the real world
now it totally made sense to have but it
did seem that kind of like they had run
out of time and they had to do
post-credit scenes yeah a lot of film
directors nowadays kind of say like oh
you know if you need post-credit scenes
that means you didn’t achieve what you
wanted in the movie and I kind of feel
that with this episode but at the same
time their scenes you really needed
especially the one with the man in black
at the end to kind of leaving it up in
the air whether he’s a host or not yeah
that was definitely like really cool and
what I don’t really understand is why
there was a need for a post-credits
scene they had an hour and a half times
and everything done and I felt like
there were a lot of scenes that could
have been shortened they could have been
generated those storylines into the
actual episode it felt like it was
really frustrating that there was so
much happening right at the end and
everything was happening right at the
end but there was an hour before where
it was just sort of like a regular
episode of watch yeah and that’s I agree
with you totally on that point but you
know like audiences loved that stuff you
know Marvel there’s 3 / 3 post-credit
scenes sometimes it’s just something
that the public really likes so I
understand why they did it but I agree
it does feel like if you can put it in a
post-credits scene just throw it in in
the episode yeah and not to say that
people shouldn’t like this episode I
think it does it does have a lot of
value and it does definitely leave a lot
to be desired for season 3 yeah I just
think for me like I wanted more from the
last episode I mean that’s fair um but I
am really excited to see what they do in
season 3 now that they’re in the real
world so let’s talk about predictions
really quickly I’m gonna talk about the
man in black whether or not he’s a host
or not I know you want to touch upon
something about that after I give my but
we had been we you know we’ve been
playing around with the idea that the
man in black was a host for a few
episodes now our co-host Rebecca had
brought it up when you were
unfortunately not with us and a lot of
the comments were like no there’s no way
this is ridiculous it’s a stupid idea
they’ve already done the whole human as
a host reveal already and I totally
agree with that but the way this season
was going they were clearly laying on
thick the hints that he was really a
host and I don’t think anyone can really
deny that and then the post-credits
scene basically almost proves that he is
a host or is he so this is a thing even
earlier in the episode after he’s cut up
his arm you don’t see whether or not
there’s a bunch of like wires or gears
or blood and veins in there it’s covered
up but at the end of the episode he sees
his daughter and then she starts
questioning him for fidelity as well so
then we’re all left to believe oh my god
he is a host because why else would they
be doing these tests but my opinion is I
know I’ve been saying that he is a host
for a little while he probably isn’t
because my prediction is at the end of
the episode Delos finds him they’re like
oh he’s in really rough shape he’s
passed out he’s lost his hand he’s lost
a ton of blood so he’s clearly
unconscious and I think that the fact
that he was struggling with with his
identity and whether or not he was a
host or a human or not while he’s passed
out he’s just having these
hallucinations and these dreams of his
daughter kind of questioning his being
so I think that’s that’s my prediction
it’ll be too on-the-nose
if he is a host but I know you want to
jump in and say something quickly about
that that’s a pretty deep cut do you
think however I’ve been doing my
research and since the episode is aired
a co-creator at least a joy has been
doing a lot of really insightful
interviews I think to sort of help
people wrap their minds around things
see I kind of try to avoid those just to
avoid spoilers a little bit but if it
provides insight yeah I know it I think
I think it more provides insight then
then it is a spoiler brace and three
okay um
when asked about that post-credit scene
with the man in black I think a lot of
people are sort of going crazy about
that yeah she said that that happens in
the far far future so I have a really
interesting prediction and you sort of
have to just like bear with me at this
point there are layers okay it’s late
opinion so basically in this episode we
see that Logan is testing his father for
fidelity
in the cradle so essentially they’re
going through the same scenario they’re
always ending up at the same point where
this point in Delos seniors journey is
the defining moment of his life
yes so obviously when the men in black
kills his daughter earlier in the season
yep that is the defining moment for him
so basically my prediction is that that
that scene is taking place in the far
far future where he is a host he had not
been before okay he is now a host
because he maybe died something happened
to him he became a host and they created
a host version of his daughter to test
for fidelity interests it would be
really similar to what’s like the
storyline with Logan and his father yeah
versus her and her father Lee yeah and
the defining moment in that test would
be him killing his daughter because
that’s the decision that he would make
every time Wow
so it is like an onion there’s a lot of
layers here it makes sense it totally
makes sense and with it being Westworld
who knows it could be true I mean twisty
and turny that’s your your your research
is pretty good I will say that I’ll
touch upon a few other like quick
predictions that we can maybe just
bounce off at the end Stubbs as well has
the conversation with Dolores disguised
as Charlotte saying basically oh you
know the old man hired me himself way
back when I don’t even remember how long
ago it was so right there you’re kind of
like oh my god okay that’s interesting
and then he starts talking about his
core drive and who he has to be loyal to
and that he has to like take care of all
the hosts on the park and he’s looking
at Dolores the whole time kind of just
like almost with a knowing look you know
yeah and then in the end he lets her go
but I mean there is strong hints that
that Stubbs is a host no yeah I agree
with you there was that moment where he
said like something that alluded to the
fact that he knew that she wasn’t who
she is and she was active known that I
have no idea I think that’s sort of like
a host thing maybe yeah maybe the
network or so host yeah yeah yeah that
was a really weird scene I think about
his character deserve
more yeah more exposition at this point
like in season 3 because that was like a
really interesting turn yes I always
thought that he was just sort of like a
throwaway character but now it seems
that like he’s a host and yes he’s
sensing that she’s gone off into the
real world he’s the only one who knows
yeah yeah I don’t know if you guys
caught any hints to that but that
totally caught me off guard I almost
think it came like completely out of
left field
agreed yeah also we talked about this
previously but Dolores also smuggled
some some spheres out of the park so
what are the skiers is it information is
it dello secret top top secret stuff is
it just other hosts who knows yeah I
think there was a part at the very
beginning of the episode when Dolores is
embracing Teddy’s lifeless body and yes
he takes his sphere did we forget about
that because maybe Charlotte is Teddy
now who is who is Charlotte because we
know that it’s not to Dolores is because
we know yeah I don’t agree with she
reincarnated herself as Charlotte and
then she reincarnated herself as herself
and now we have Charlotte Bernard
and Dolores but you know it’s Charlotte
I think it might be Teddy I’m not sure
about I mean yeah I’m not sure because
she has his fear yeah and she implants
she implants it into the system and then
sends him to for lack of a better term
you know that the other Valley be yeah
and he’s there and he’s smiling and he’s
kind of at peace with himself so if he’s
there can he be in the reader no I mean
I think that would be really cool I
think that yeah it would be interesting
to have like a female relationship
because we know like you know Teddy and
doors are so many cool to sort of have
Charlotte and Dolores interrelationship
like that Charlotte actually being Teddy
yeah yeah that’s very interesting um I’m
not sure about that
yes it’ll happen I don’t know if you
guys think that’ll be that will happen
but if you have any predictions please
feel free to write them in the comments
so that sadly marks the end of season 2
West Worldwatch Club guys thank you so
much for taking this journey with us if
you want to watch more TV stuff and
movie stuff be sure to subscribe to the
channel
and that basically wraps it all up so
for myself and Phoebe thank you so much
for watching we’ll see you next time so
that’s our breakdown what do you guys
think let us know in the comments below
check out our other episodes here and
some of your other favorite shows right here
Please follow and like us: